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Red Cross Seeks 'Digital Emblem' To Protect Against Hacking (apnews.com) 50

An anonymous reader quotes a report from the Associated Press: The International Committee of the Red Cross said Thursday it is seeking support to create a "digital red cross/red crescent emblem" that would make clear to military and other hackers that they have entered the computer systems of medical facilities or Red Cross offices. The Geneva-based humanitarian organization said it was calling on governments, Red Cross and Red Crescent societies, and IT experts to join forces in developing "concrete ways to protect medical and humanitarian services from digital harm during armed conflict."

For over 150 years, symbols such as the red cross have been used to make clear that "in times of armed conflict, those who wear the red cross or facilities and objects marked with them must be protected from harm," the ICRC said. That same obligation should apply online, the organization said, noting that hacking operations in conflicts were likely to increase as more militaries develop cyber capabilities. The organization said that for the proposed "digital emblem" to become reality, nations worldwide would have to agree on its use and make it part of international humanitarian law alongside existing humanitarian insignia. It hopes the emblem would identify the computer systems of protected facilities much as a red cross or crescent on a hospital roof does in the real world.
"The International Committee of the Red Cross said that it has identified three technical possibilities: a DNS-based emblem that would use a special label to link it to a domain name; an IP-based emblem; and an ADEM, or authenticated digital emblem, system that would use certificate chains to signal protection," adds the report.
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Red Cross Seeks 'Digital Emblem' To Protect Against Hacking

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  • by Anonymouse Cowtard ( 6211666 ) on Friday November 04, 2022 @01:19AM (#63023441) Homepage

    Nice idea. Until every node waves the Red Cross/Crescent. Maybe when we have a quantum internet it will become feasible.

    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      How is that any different to real life, where there is nothing to stop militaries abusing the Red Cross? Well, except that it's a war crime, but as long as you win there is little chance of ever being prosecuted.

  • As if (Score:5, Insightful)

    by quonset ( 4839537 ) on Friday November 04, 2022 @01:30AM (#63023451)

    When the Red Cross and other organizations gave specific locations of hospitals in Syria to the Syrian government and its Russian backers as a way to protect them, each and every hospital was deliberately bombed by Russia and Syria [nytimes.com].

    In Ukraine, Russia has done the same thing [sky.com].

    If the Red Cross and Red Crescent and whomever else thinks having an "emblem" will protect them, they're delusional.

    • Re:As if (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 04, 2022 @02:13AM (#63023489)

      If the Red Cross and Red Crescent and whomever else thinks having an "emblem" will protect them, they're delusional.

      It protects them in the exact same way laws against murder protect you from being shot dead.

      This fantasy you invented implying laws a preventative measures in anyway beyond a possible deterrent is the delusion.

      Despite people like yourself that argue laws against murder are worthless, the vast majority of the world would still rather have those laws in place, knowing they will cause consequences after the fact.

      This is no different.
      You are obviously unaware, but it is Russia breaking these "worthless" laws as you call them, that has legitimized the rest of the world cutting off Russia from the global economy.
      They are the very thing enabling the cutoff of their support.

      Look at it from the other side too. Ukraine is actually following international law by NOT attacking humanitarian personnel, and due to following that law, they are receiving significant support from other NATO nations, despite Ukraine not being a NATO member.
      Russia has requested similar support from their own allies, and all of their allies except Syria and North Korea refuse to do so, showing the deterrent effect works.
      Even China has told them to kindly fuck off and stop making them look bad.

      The delusion here is believing everything in the world is as simple as black and white, and nothing in between can possibly exist. That is just insanity.

      • I'm unsure why you chose to put the word worthless in quotes. We all know that no group has ever used hospitals to house soldiers.

    • In Syria, it was partly because the local guerrillas deliberately setup up camp as close as possible to the hospitals. I've personally no idea if the same occurred in Ukraine, but Israel encounters the same problem with Palestine.

      • Re: (Score:1, Troll)

        by quonset ( 4839537 )

        In Syria, it was partly because the local guerrillas deliberately setup up camp as close as possible to the hospitals. I've personally no idea if the same occurred in Ukraine, but Israel encounters the same problem with Palestine.

        Bullshit. The hospitals in Syria were out in the open, with the red cross easily visible from the air. There were no camps anywhere near these. In some cases the hospitals were moved to caves and those were bombed.

        As for Palestine, Israel's apartheid causes those issues. If Israel would stop occuyping Palesitnian land there wouldn't be an issue.

    • When the Red Cross and other organizations gave specific locations of hospitals in Syria to the Syrian government and its Russian backers as a way to protect them, each and every hospital was deliberately bombed by Russia and Syria [nytimes.com].

      In Ukraine, Russia has done the same thing [sky.com].

      If the Red Cross and Red Crescent and whomever else thinks having an "emblem" will protect them, they're delusional.

      Odd that it would take the Red Cross to identify where hospitals are. I'm pretty sure Russia or Syria could have figured out how to type a "hospitals near me" request in many a navigational online offering used the world over for the last decade or so. For any major regional hospital, their locations end up about as "secret" as the local McDonalds.

      That said, you're correct. Emblems won't protect anyone in war where pretty much all bets are off. We can talk about civility and Conventions we've agreed to

      • Odd that it would take the Red Cross to identify where hospitals are.

        Some of these were makeshift hospitals due to the fact Russia and Syria had bombed the original hospitals. The Red Cross wanted these places clearly identified in an attempt to protect them.

        Instead, Russia and Syria used the coordiantes for targeting.

    • To be fair, there's also the ongoing violations by the Saudi military (supported by the US & UK military) deliberately targeting Red Cross hospitals as well as UNHCR camps & schools.

      Those are war crimes & specifically identified as such but unlikely to go prosecuted because of who's involved, i.e. the Hague are unlikely to indict & prosecute Saudi, US, or UK leaders or generals.

      However, that doesn't diminish the deterrent effects of having international laws & criminal courts for try
      • Also worth noting that war is in as of itself an obscenity & that laws governing war are a bit like putting a Band Aid on a cancer. Laws represent civilisation & war is the suspension of civilisation & legal oversight, effectively permitting all kinds of crimes to go unaccountable at every level of administration, from criminal gangs involved in human trafficking & forced prostitution of women & children, to generals targeting civilians, hospitals & fleeing refugees. All sides point
  • For 150 years western armies have hidden ammunition in ambulances and then castigated their opponents for blowing up those ambulances. Now they want to hide hacking and disinformation operations under the red cross. Good luck with that
  • Does the current red cross emblem protect the organization against anyone else but immediate physical harm, such as bombing, shooting, etc? Do the treaties talk about guarantees against being infiltrated by spies, or from having its supply lines cut off (i.e. enemy must pass red cross supplies though its lines per treaty), or from sabotage, etc? If it's only against immediate physical harm, then a digital version is not going to do much.
  • by Rosco P. Coltrane ( 209368 ) on Friday November 04, 2022 @03:35AM (#63023545)

    make clear to military and other hackers that they have entered the computer systems of medical facilities or Red Cross offices.

    Hackers already hit hospitals with ransomware [nbcnews.com] and they know perfectly well who they're hurting. How is the digital Red Cross going to stop them? It would only work if they had principles and they clearly don't.

    • A digital Red Cross is little more than a login banner. On Government systems holding classified data, the login banner is quite extensive, warning you about all the bad shit that could happen to you if you abuse that system.

      All of it means nothing without enforcement.

      Hackers get caught and prosecuted? Chop off a limb and force them to report to the closest medical facility with a mandatory 3-hour wait to simulate a hacked environment. See how that works out for them. "Hacking" will put an entertainin

  • by Rosco P. Coltrane ( 209368 ) on Friday November 04, 2022 @03:39AM (#63023547)

    Then nobody could enter their systems and they wouldn't need to warn attackers that they're hitting nice people in the first place.

  • This is the inverse of the Evil bit [rfc-editor.org].
  • "Yes, you can trust me."

    "Oh, thank goodness."
  • "Oh, hey, it's a medical infrastructure system. Paydirt! Leave no part of it intact, wreck everything!"
  • ACiD [acid.org] should do them up a fly ANSI super-banner. I will run 3 Vision-X nodes for them on Courier HST's!
  • Are they just talking about becoming a CA ?
  • User-agent: *
    Disallow: Russkis
  • Cyberwar is an emerging form of war and the Red Cross needs a method to identify their systems so they aren't attacked.

    What's to stop them from being attacked anyhow? Only self-interest: if you don't attack mine, I won't attack yours.

  • Obviously the Red Cross/Red Crescent have no idea how hacking works. Nobody is going to see a "digital emblem" marking their computer as being from a nonprofit/aid organisation... that's just ridiculous.
  • Where are the Arisians when you really need them ?

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