2013 H-1B Visa Supply Nearly Exhausted 428
CowboyRobot writes with news on the FY2013 allocation of H-1B visas. From the article: "As of June 1, the government had issued 55,600 standard H-1B visas out of the annual allotment of 65,000, according to United States Immigration and Citizenship Services (USCIS). The feds also issued 18,700 H-1B visas reserved for graduates of advanced degree programs in the U.S., out of 20,000. " CowboyRobot continues, "Last year work visas did not run out until late November, but this year the pool of visas is almost entirely claimed and it's still only June. One interpretation of this is that the tech industry is hiring much more actively than it was a year ago. Some companies, such as Microsoft, have been lobbying to increase the number of available visas (currently limited to 65,000) while others argue that offering visas to foreign workers reduces job prospects for Americans."
A bit more from the article: "Industry lobby group Partnership for A New American Economy last month released a study that claims the U.S. will face a shortage of 224,000 tech workers by 2018 unless immigration rules are loosened."
Thank God. (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Hire the unemployed (Score:5, Informative)
Someone needs to figure out a way to get the people who are out of work in touch with these companies who are "desperate" to fill these open positions. It's a win-win situation.
Won't work. Many of those Americans aren't skilled in tech, and none of them are willing to be treated as slaves. That means that they'll have the temerity to demand proper training and pay! That would never do, as it might slightly cut into the fat bonuses given to part of the 1% lording it over the tech industry...
Re:Hire the unemployed (Score:5, Informative)
AC wrote:
>Americans ask for more money than they are worth.
No, Americans ask for more money than H1B visa holders are willing to work for. Wages as a share of the GDP peaked in 1972 in the U.S. yet profits over-all are still going up --- H1B visas are a tiny part of how corporations are able to get more work done for less money paid so as to maximize profit.
H-1bs Drive Out Skilled But Not Unskilled (Score:5, Informative)
Study: When highly skilled immigrants move in, highly skilled natives move out [eurekalert.org]
In the first study to measure the temporary impact of highly skilled immigrants on native populations, University of Notre Dame Economist Abigail Wozniak and Fairfield University's Thomas J. Murray — a former Notre Dame graduate student — found that when highly skilled immigrants move to a city or town, the U.S. natives in that area who are also highly skilled tend to move away. However, the study found that the same immigrant group's presence decreases the chances that low-skilled natives would leave.
"High skill" refers to those having some post-secondary education or above, while "low skill" are those with a high school diploma or less education. "Natives" refer to U.S. citizens by birth.
According to the study, which will appear in the July issue of the Journal of Urban Economics, smaller and more geographically isolated cities show the biggest impacts. There was little difference in results between growing versus declining cities.
"We conclude that natives with less education take longer to adjust to the arrival of immigrants in their local labor market than do natives with more education," Wozniak says. "These effects are more pronounced in smaller, more isolated communities, from where it would be more difficult and expensive for less skilled natives to relocate."...
Re:Hire the unemployed (Score:5, Informative)
These companies aren't hiring anyone that they would have to train unless they're just looking for an H1B worker. I work for a large multinational company in the U.S. and I have seen the job postings they put out. They're so full of precise specifics that the worker absolutely must have that an American engineer won't be able to fit the bill. Then they hire the H1B from the overseas office that they had in mind in the first place (and who fit the onerous job requirements exactly, strangely enough) and pay him less. It's a scam. What we need is a nice, well-funded PAC for IT workers and engineers that can lean on the lawmakers and tell Oracle and Micro$oft to get bent. The only way to get the lawmakers to listen to us is to bribe them with campaign contributions. It sucks, but that's the system we have in this country.
Oh, and this Project for a New American Economy reminds me a lot of the Project for a New American Century, which brought us the Iraq war.
Re:Thank God. (Score:4, Informative)
I'm pretty sure that in America the H-1Bs have to be paid the same as a local, except that practically they are often underpaid and if they complain they are shipped out before the matter gets to court. There's no point in having laws if they're never enforced.
Re:Hire the unemployed (Score:2, Informative)
Its relatively cheap, usually financed by parents with the expectation that you will finance your kids education and so on, hence loans are minimal at best
And, I doubt many Europeans want to come to the US anyways (as you mention, Indians get most H1B's)
Re:Thank God. (Score:3, Informative)
The H-1B is for individuals at the top of their respective field, and it only accounts for 65,000 out of more than 6 million visas alloted per year. Say what you will about work visas in general, and granted the H-1B lasts longer than most other work visas, but H-1B visas are not where I would begin making cuts! They allow us to sap the smartest minds from other coutries, and use them for our own benefit, to benefit our own industries and own economy.
Re:Thank God. (Score:2, Informative)
"there are no benefits to pay"...of the all the H1B using people I have known, none have been contract workers without benefits.
Re:Shortage by 2018 (Score:4, Informative)
Surely the last remaining world super-power could manage that?
Well yes, they probably could, but I fail to see what China has to do with any of this...
Re:Thank God. (Score:3, Informative)
We have a small number of H-1B's and they're totally able to compete. Large Big Box Indian Body Shop brings them over, most are frauds and don't know squat. However, for the few that are the real deal, they quickly realize that they can earn 30, 40 or 50k more by taking their talents elsewhere. I've gotten some of my best developers by taking on their H-1's when they finally clued into the assraping they're getting from the big boys.
L-1's are the real enemy. They are typically brought over on a lower than industry average salary, but are locked into a 2-3 year deal where the only move they can make away from Large Big Box Indian Body Shop is to go back to India (or their home country). L-1's == institutionalized indentured servitude.
In summary, H-1's do allow for competition, L-1's do not.
Re:Thank God. (Score:5, Informative)
A bigger issue for me is that I don't want to bring in somebody making $120K if the average salary is $90K
And the big problem with H1B visas is that they artificially DRIVE DOWN the average salary (much as illegal workers do too).
I'll give you a very concrete example. When I was in college, I used to work farm labor during the summers. This was before the glut of illegals started coming up heavily in the area. At that time, farm labor paid a very respectable $7 an hour (one of the best local salaries an unskilled worker could get). Just a few years later, I started to see more and more illegals working those same fields I had. I was talking to an old friend from the area and asked him if he was still working during the summers. He told me that the standard salary had dropped to $4-$5 an hour for the same work we used to do for $7. The good jobs disappeared because the greedy piece-of-shit farmers in the area knew they could hire illegals that cheap easily (and make no mistake about it, the "noble" American farmer is one of the greediest pieces of shit you will ever encounter in your life). And I bet those same farmers would have raised hell if there had been a crackdown on illegals, complaining to the government that they "just couldn't find workers" (at $4-$5 and hour, of course).
Re:Thank God. (Score:1, Informative)
On behalf of all H1B visa holders, I'd like to say the following:
Sir, they're not hiring me only because they can afford to pay me less, they're hiring me because I do a better job, for less money and you can't compete with me.
You can't compete with me because I have *serious* incentive to succeed - I've got family overseas who are not as fortunate as yours. I have the kind of drive to succeed that only people who need to survive have, not the "Oh my gosh, I'm going to see the Knicks" drive. So I'll leave you in the dust, if we were to compete.
While you were playing Call of Duty on your XBOX, I was taking Calculus 1 as part of my curriculum in *high school*. By the time I graduated from high school, I already studied Finite Math, Linear Algebra, Calculus 1 and some Calculus 2. That's in between the 15 other subjects I had every year since I was 12. You can probably realize how "difficult" college in the US seemed to me.
I went to the same school as you did, but I didn't get the same education. I got a _better_ education. While you were struggling with determinants, I was reading books *outside* the curriculum, to further my domain-specific knowledge. By the time I graduated from college, I had 4 summer internships.
In fact, even my English is better than yours. I studied the English _grammar_ since I was 8 and I challenge you to find a grammatical mistake in my comment. I have a slight accent, but I can deliver my thoughts correctly and coherently, and that'll always prevail over your opinionated, arrogant delivery method you used above. Initially, when I came to the US, I wasn't aware of all the slang used around me, but I picked it up fairly quickly. That's how people learn and adapt, and because of my adaptability, I'm more competitive than you.
While we're on the language topic, can you at least type one sentence in any of the other 3 languages I speak? For your own sake, I hope you can, because at an international corporation, I'll be able to interact with clients and users in their native language, while you're looking up "How are you?" in your pocket dictionary. Why would they hire you? Just because you know some English slang? I have already picked it up. You ain't got nothin' on me, pal.
You were born in the US, I was born overseas. Neither of us was given a choice, but you got lucky (that perception may vary). Why do you feel entitled to the jobs in the US? Your laws allow me to compete and they're there for a reason - to light some fire under your behind. And make no mistake - I packed both the gasoline and the matches.
Clearly, you'd prefer to be paid 150k and do no work. Who wouldn't? But it doesn't work like that. So if you don't like the laws, move to a different country - i'll be happy to show you how. You may need to start adapting though.
And finally, I'm inherently not racist. I come from a country where everyone has the same skin color. You may think that might make me racist, but I don't have the same preconceptions as you do. The first time I saw a black person, I was genuinely curious to see what differences and similarities we have, the same way you see something new and you're curious about it. I realize everyone is a human being and I treat them as my equals. I see how they're different and I respect that. The first time I saw a gay person, I noticed they behave a bit differently, but I respect their choice. I treat you as my equal too, even though you've offended me and everyone who's like me.
I respect you as my competitor and I see your dissatisfaction as a way to compete with me, whether you're doing it consciously or not. If enough people complain, the laws will be changed, and I won't be allowed to be part of the game. Then, you'll get your 150k to sit on a couch and watching TV all day long, for a short period of time, until your economy collapses while you're superseded by other countries. And it all starts with you, the person who can't compete and makes noise.
So that's what I bring to the table. What did you bring?