Getting Rid of Staff With High Access?

HikingStick writes "I've been in the tech field for over 15 years. After more than nine years with the same company, I've been asked to step in and establish an IT department for a regional manufacturing firm. I approached my company early, providing four weeks notice (including a week of pre-scheduled [and pre-approved] vacation time). I have a number of projects to complete, and had planned to document some of the obscure bits of knowledge I've gleaned over the past nine years for the benefit of my peers, so I figured that would give me plenty of time. That was on a Friday. The following Monday, word came down from above that all of my privileged access was to be removed — immediately. So, here I sit, stripped of power with weeks ahead of me. From discussions with my peers in other companies, I know that cutting off high-privilege users is common, but usually in conjunction with a severance offer (to keep their hands off the network during those final weeks, especially if there is any ill-will). Should I argue for restored access, highlight the fact that I am currently a human paperweight, request a severance package, or simply become the most prolific Slashdot poster over the next few weeks? Does your company have a policy/process for dealing with high-privilege users who give notice? What is it, and do you make exceptions?"

It's really the company's decision

[xmas2003]

Your situation kinda sucks as it sounds like you are a diligent worker who wants to help the company. But as long as they are paying you, it's really their choice how they want to use your services. All you can do is when your co-workers ask for your help in passing the torch, mention that you are hand-cuffed by the lack of access and have them request it for you.

P.S. Some activities to pass the time would include Watching Grass Grow [watching-grass-grow.com] and/or Watching Paint Dry. [watching-paint-dry.com]

Request "Gardening Leave"

[Pope]

a delightful term I learned from my UK counterparts. Essentially you're still under employ by the current company so cannot do work for your new one or any competition, and you relax at home while getting paid. It's like paid vacation, except not, since you could theoretically be called in to work at any point.

AKA. request to work from home if your access is revoked, since you can't do anything at that location now anyway.

Access removal

[trippd6]

I have worked for 3 hosting companies. My experiance has been: If you are not considered a risk, you are allowed to work your final weeks with full access. If you are REMOTELY considered a risk, you are imediately walked out, although you are paid for your final weeks.

Any good admin/manager knows if you have physical access, you might as well have root/admininistrator access.

Nothing new here

[sjvn]

It seems to be common now for companies' to strip users of all their privileges ASAP. If you think this was bad, be glad you're not be laid-off. I've often many people tell me that they learned they no longer had a job when their sessions were terminated in the middle of the work day.

Welcome to the work-world of the 21st century.

Steven
http://www.practical-tech.com/ [practical-tech.com]
http://blogs.computerworld.com/sjvn [computerworld.com]

Here's a plan:

[Ihlosi]

1. Do nothing. 2. Keep bits of obscure information for yourself unless they come asking for it. 3. Start new job. 4. ??? 5. PROFIT !

Rumor has it that step 4 has something to do with becoming a highly-paid consultant for the old company.

Take the high road

[8127972]

If they want to keep you from doing your job, they're only going to be hurting themselves and their isn't really much that you can do about that. But what you can do is to do what you can to leave on the best of terms. Just because they decide to be dorks doesn't mean that you have to respond in kind. It's really important to not burn bridges as you might need them for a reference some day. Document whatever obscure bits that you need to and do knowledge transfer with those you can work with. Then you can move on with you conscience clear.

Go on gardening leave.

[Paul Johnson]

I'd ask for "gardening leave" (i.e. be allowed to go home rather than forced to sit twiddling your thumbs all day). You might also offer to sit down with a co-worker and tell them about all the stuff you were doing so they can take it over.

This is almost certainly not personal. Your senior management has obviously made a policy decision that the risks of leaving you with access to the systems are more important than the costs of locking you out. Obviously *you* know you are honest and safe, but they can't take that risk. If you think about the amount of damage you could have done if so inclined, you might see the point. There are quite a few horror stories about disaffected employees and computer systems.

Re:Are you crazy

[shawnmchorse]

Have you ever had nothing to do at work for that long? I can handle surfing the Internet at work for maybe a week. After that, the boredom is excruciating. Believe me, being completely ignored by your company can sometimes be almost as bad as other things.

You're not supposed to finish your projects

[notthepainter]

Really, you aren't.

You should spend the next 3 weeks documenting your projects. That is what the company needs from you. So few companies get this, want you coding until the last minute.

What happens when your stuff breaks? The next folks start at your documentation and go from there. Internal wiki's are great for this.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[Jason Earl]

What the organization really needs is some time to find out what sorts of things break when you aren't around to poke at them. For the next month they have the benefit of your knowledge, should they need it, but you won't be able to do stuff. This will allow existing staff members to learn to cover gaps while you are still around in case of an emergency.

You are leaving. The company is far less interested in what you can do for them in your last few weeks than they are in learning how to live without you. That basically requires that they cut you out of the loop as soon as possible.

Consult your replacement.

[jellomizer]

That would be the ethical thing to do. At this stage you don't need the high access as your replacement has the access. I would work closely with your replacement explaining things to them that may not be nessarly documented, even if they are documented people most likely don't want to read it. So use the time to give your replacement the upper hand. There is a lot you can do without having root/administrator access.

Re:Are you crazy

[i.r.id10t]

Good time to pick up a new skill/programming language or refresh your knowledge, etc.

Re:personally

[Swampash]

Option C will enable the company to fire his ass and show him the door for misconduct, WITHOUT four weeks of pay.

Re:They are protecting their assets

[Ihlosi]

How does the company know that you are giving 4 weeks notice so you can train other employees or finish projects? How do they NOT know that you aren't going to spend the next four weeks setting up timebomb scripts or sabotaging equipment?

Anyone who is malicious and has half a working brain would, of course, do all of that evil stuff before giving any notice. Do they really think that all of their employees are malicious, incompetent, backstabbing morons ?

You could be trying to steal information or recruit your coworkers to your new job.

Yes, the free market is a cool thing, as long as it doesn't impact the bottom line. Then you should fight it tooth and claw. And you should hang on to moronic employees who can't look for better jobs themselves, but need to be recruited by a coworker. Geez. Some people in charge must really, really think that all of their employees are a bunch of dimwitted morons. Maybe they're right, too.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[chill]

That's the beauty of it, he already has the next job and doesn't need a reference.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[egburr]

Don't do this. They aren't wasting your time. They are still paying you. Instead, consider talking to your boss about leaving sooner (if you are ready to move to the new job) since they have nothing for you to do.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[demodocus]

I'm surprised you still have physical access to the building as well. I am sure it is nothing personal. Look at it this way, it protects you and the company. No one can come back on you and say you broke something in production.

Re:They are protecting their assets

[Lumpy]

How do they NOT know that you aren't going to spend the next four weeks setting up timebomb scripts or sabotaging equipment?

because anyone competent in such things had them in place months ago.

He's leaving on good terms, he would not timebomb anything. Disgruntled employees? they had their timebombs in place for months. Best if you know that most of the backup tapes are also infected with it so they cant easily roll it back.

I know I have had to disarm may disgruntled timebombs left by people. The really clever guys had them there for a long time so it's a major bugger to get rid of them. One was part virus and replicated and replaced it's self afte a bit of random time (3-10 days later it pops back up.)

Re:They are protecting their assets

[Todd Knarr]

My immediate response to this would be "They are the same person they were before they gave notice. If you believed they'd be so unprofessional, so untrustworthy, then why did you give them that access in the first place?". Simply giving notice isn't anything special or unusual. Everybody leaves their job. The head of HR will one day give his 2-weeks notice. Even the CEO of the company will one day leave for another position. The company itself isn't going to be shy about telling employees that outsourced contractors are a better opportunity for the company and the employee's services are no longer required. So why all this uproar and upset about this?

Re:Nice to know

[FritzTheCat1030]

My family owns a couple of businesses, when an employee gives notice -- we say -- thanks, the good news is you can start your new job early. Security escorts them out, problem solved.

They give notice, you respond by firing them. In many instances, you're going to pay for their unemployment benefits now. Not to mention, if you have important employees who you would LIKE to get notice from if they decide to leave, they're much less likely to give you notice now since they know of your previous behavior.

Re:Nothing new here

[An dochasac]

Welcome to the work-world of the 21st century.

No, welcome to the work-world of the U.S. (circa 1990-200?). Much of the world hasn't adopted these draconian and dehumanizing disemployment procedures. They rely on human decency during severance just as U.S. companies once did.

The common practice of frog walking terminated employees to the nearest exit results in far more long term damage than the hypothetical "disgruntled employee on his/her way out" ever could. I suspect some of the HR managers came up with this process in order to meld the Japanese "work to death" management theories with the U.S. "T minus 0 seconds of job security." It doesn't work but it gives the HR wonks something to justify their own jobs. Think of it this way, when Joe employee has zero job security, every minute of every day becomes a "I may be on my way out" minute. What makes that employee any less likely to do the damage 30 seconds before the termination decision is made? This is what we have across the U.S. right now and people wonder why you can't get a clerk at the *mart, why you can't get good service anywhere and why corporations are infested with incompetent, selfish, opportunists [slashdot.org] who steal from customers and sabotage companies and co-workers in order to gain "job security." The team player is dead, it's every man for himself in corporate America.

The odd thing is that these same American multinational companies often do have sane and humane exit policies for their outsourced contractors and their overseas employees.

Re:Nice to know

[SCHecklerX]

that's a pretty fucked up attitude. Perhaps the employee is at a point where they have grown beyond where the current place can offer them any promotion or challenging/interesting new work? In fact, once you have mastered a job, you tend to automate it to the point where you become bored and need new challenges. You certainly can spend the time transitioning knowledge to other people. The notice also gives the company that time to do that transition. You don't even need privileged system access for that type of thing. Escorting people out the door just because they have decided they can no longer grow within their current position, especially if they have done years of good work for you is pretty arrogant and stupid. How about chatting with the person about why they want to leave and see if there is some good option that benefits everyone instead?

Re:Wow

[bonehead]

I was in the exact same position once. 3 weeks notice, ability to do my job completely cut off, but still expected to be there and still getting paid.

I brought in a large stack of books and my laptop, and began brushing up on skills that I needed in my new job but had become a bit rusty on.

Then there was the time I gave 2 weeks notice at a large bank (you've all heard of them). I was immediately escorted out the door, and 3 days later got a check in the mail for the 2 weeks I had offered notice for, plus the 3 weeks of vacation that I still had coming. Cashed the check, hopped in the car, and went on a nice 2 week road trip.

Re:Are you crazy

[smellsofbikes]

Wow. I've been sitting here for five minutes rereading this post -- while doing other things -- and I can't get it out of my head.
I can't imagine something better than being paid to read Wikipedia and learn stuff all day long for months at a time. That's basically a MacArthur grant.
I'd learn Icelandic, finish my PIC data acquisition unit, re-learn synthetic organic chemistry, design and build a couple power supplies, actually learn electrical engineering rather than just pretending to know it, build a suit of chainmail, learn enough aerodynamics to design a new set of wings for a homebuilt plane... I could spend three years of 8 hour days online with ease, and love every second of it.
(I know this because after a car crash I spent about six weeks bedridden and that's exactly what I did the whole time, and it was *glorious*. I learned enough Japanese to have semi-intelligent conversations and taught myself Perl during that painful vacation.)

Re:It's really the company's decision

[Kelbear]

I recommend the parent's suggestion. Continue your remaining work days by assisting your replacements. Not just because you're still being paid, but because it's satisfying to give your best work with what you have. If this means that getting access back is necessary, then start that process as well. Idling is nice as a break here and then, but a whole day of it will be very unfulfilling.

Also, It's nice to leave without burning bridges. Who knows, maybe some of the people you leave behind may remember you in a positive light later in your career and provide an opportunity?

Re:Nice to know

[darth dickinson]

If your management is piss poor and you don't have proper documentation and SOPs then you place yourself at the mercy of your employees -- which is a very bad place to be.

Uh, aren't you always at the mercy of your employees? After all, if you could do it all yourself, why hire people?

You sound like a joy to work for.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[Anonymous Coward]

Give seminars/lessons/tutorials on various, purely trivial topics. Teach the ... origins of the Gin and Tonic.

Blasphemy! There is nothing trivial about the Gin and Tonic.

Re:Most are set out the door immediately

[CopaceticOpus]

This seems really silly. Since the employee is the one giving notice, he probably would not have motivation to cause damage before leaving. Furthermore, if he wanted to open a back door or steal code before leaving, he could simply do it before he gave notice.

On the other hand, those two weeks could be a really crucial time for the employee to document his knowledge and train others. Any company that won't take advantage of those two weeks is probably just being paranoid.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[CohibaVancouver]

,Also, It's nice to leave without burning bridges. Who knows, maybe some of the people you leave behind may remember you in a positive light later in your career and provide an opportunity?

This advice is bang-on. It may be a boring two weeks, but c'est la vie. Whatever you do, don't rock any boats or burn any bridges. What goes around, comes around.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[SanityInAnarchy]

You are leaving. The company is far less interested in what you can do for them in your last few weeks than they are in learning how to live without you.

The two are related. From the original question:

I have a number of projects to complete, and had planned to document some of the obscure bits of knowledge I've gleaned over the past nine years for the benefit of my peers, so I figured that would give me plenty of time.

That seems like a perfectly reasonable thing to do, and much more useful than simply pulling the plug to see what breaks.

Re:Apologies

[Anonymous Coward]

you fucking prick

Re:Are you crazy

[potat0man]

As a programmer I actually want and need to ... Program!

So why didn't you?

Just because no one is telling you what to write doesn't mean you can't be coding something.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[punissuer]

The company is far less interested in what you can do for them in your last few weeks than they are in learning how to live without you. That basically requires that they cut you out of the loop as soon as possible.

And it would be nice of them to phrase it that way.

Re:Risk

[HEbGb]

People do all sorts of dumb/dishonest things at the conclusion of their employment, regardless of the terms. The companies are right to protect themselves.

Re:Nice to know

[SanityInAnarchy]

After all -- do they give you notice when your going to be let go?

Depends. Sometimes, yes.

My family owns a couple of businesses, when an employee gives notice -- we say -- thanks, the good news is you can start your new job early. Security escorts them out...

Ok, stop right there.

Do you really want to leave that impression? You've trusted this person forhowever many years, and now you don't even trust them to find their own way out of the building?

Remember, employees can give references too. First day at the new job, if people start asking about my old one, I'd say "You know, it was great for awhile, but when I gave notice, they fired me. Can't really recommend them."

It also means that you're encouraging exactly the behavior you suggested -- no matter how high up or how important a particular employee is, they're much more likely to just quit than to give notice, even when you'd like a bit of notice, for a smooth transition -- close projects, etc.

It's a waste of money to pay someone who doesn't even want to be working for you.

Maybe something better came along? I don't know about you, but while most jobs I've been at have been pretty good, if Google made me an offer, I'd be gone. That doesn't mean I have any beef with wherever I'm working at the time -- it just means I found somewhere better.

If your management is piss poor and you don't have proper documentation and SOPs then you place yourself at the mercy of your employees -- which is a very bad place to be.

And if you do have proper documentation and SOPs, constantly enforced, then you place yourself at the mercy of your managers and process -- which is an equally bad place to be.

Find a balance. And remember, even if I am keeping documentation up to date, that doesn't mean spending a week or two reviewing it, or compiling a little handbook of unorthodox tips and tricks, is wasted.

If you don't trust your employees, don't hire them. Hire employees you can trust.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[gartogg]

Why does noone take a break between jobs - tell the new job you'll start in a month, and go to the beach. Or skiing. Of just play D&D for a couple weeks straight. Whatever.

And if you tell me that you need a paycheck to pay the mortgage, electric bill, or whatever, you aren't being fiscally responsible having no safety buffer. If you think that it doesn't matter unless something goes wrong, well, your life sucks more that it needs to because you aren't taking the vacation.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[encoderer]

I dunno... If i'm that coworker, even if I like you, why would I go to mgmt and argue on your behalf?

If anything I would see it as an opportunity to demonstrate that I CAN handle things without you.

If I'm the manager and you come to me and say "You have to restore his privileges! I can't get my job done without him!" ...well... I'd probably think that the guy is leaving in a couple weeks so maybe I should hire somebody who CAN.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[LandDolphin]

The only thing I can think of is that they know if you do anything stupid...it is a major federal offense..and that that would be a deterrent?

I think that little bit of knowledge goes pretty far.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[Catiline]

YOu give your notice...you get to work normally till your last day.
The only thing I can think of is that they know if you do anything stupid...it is a major federal offense..and that that would be a deterrent?

No, it is that the US Government isn't concerned about hostile employees like the private sector is. After all, to get that job you went though a very rigorous screening process (much tougher than the private sector) -- if they thought there was a chance of your being a bad apple, you wouldn't have been hired.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[cayenne8]

"No, it is that the US Government isn't concerned about hostile employees like the private sector is. After all, to get that job you went though a very rigorous screening process (much tougher than the private sector) -- if they thought there was a chance of your being a bad apple, you wouldn't have been hired."

LOL..what gave you that idea that you were scrutinzed so carefully?

Basically, you gotta be a US citizen....and be at the right time at the right place...I've seen it before. Most contractors are just trying to fill seats with bodies to get billing. I've often seen those that were barely competent get in....but, it is mostly about bodies in seats at many, many sites.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[ari_j]

I thought about going with the Cuba Libre, but the G&T has a more interesting story with more twists than the Cuba Libre does, and it also gets the HHGG reference bonus points.

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Re:It's really the company's decision

[Anonymous Coward]

Lot's of interesting feedback on this topic. Realistically though a knowledge transfer and documentation will take about 3 days. Human nature will limit your actual drive to really participate in the goings on of your present employer despite your best intentions. Yes the honorable and professional approach is to document what you can considering your no access to systems and explain somethings as best you can to your fellow coworkers. Then sit back and learn something new or request gardening leave. But let's be real here folks about the level of dedication one can expect from someone already looking forward to their next job.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[ari_j]

You forget that the guy works a job for a decade at a time. I'm fairly confident that he's not leaving this one to start bouncing around from employer to employer every 3 months.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[moderatorrater]

In that case, then I don't support the employee giving the current employer a choice. A company that's going to look out for their best interest without regard for their employees' needing to know the procedure for leaving the job isn't going to get the courtesy of me sticking around to help them out. I understand the desire to do what's best for the company in all situations, but if they take my needs and desires out of the equation that determines what they do, I'm going to take their needs and desires out of consideration for what I do.

In other words, if they're not going to be courteous enough to let me know whether or not they'll want two weeks, I'm not going to be courteous enough to give them the option.

Re:Well SOX compliance and auditors are forcing ma

[torkus]

Ah, but don't you know? No individual (without an executive title) is ever considered 'important' to a company. Proving that fact is far more important than meeting deadlines :)

And for those thinking to flag troll - i've seen this actually happen numerous times. Besides, if you miss a deadline because of someone who's no longer around it's pretty easy to blame them eh?

Re:It's really the company's decision

[edremy]

Some of us have kids. Work *is* my break...

Re:It's really the company's decision

[billcopc]

I always thought it was a dumb idea to escort people out that way. Sure, their justification makes sense on its own, but put into perspective it's a wedgeless argument.

If I were planning to screw my employer by stealing/leaking sensitive information, I wouldn't give them 2 weeks notice. I'd just suddenly stop showing up to work, go on sick leave until they fire me or something.

There is no security. If you can't trust your employee, you shouldn't have employed them in the first place.

No buffer.

[maillemaker]

>Why does noone take a break between jobs - tell the new job you'll start in a month, and go to the beach.
>Or skiing. Of just play D&D for a couple weeks straight. Whatever.

>And if you tell me that you need a paycheck to pay the mortgage, electric bill, or whatever, you aren't being
>fiscally responsible having no safety buffer. If you think that it doesn't matter unless something goes wrong, well,
>your life sucks more that it needs to because you aren't taking the vacation.

Well you answered your own question. Most people live paycheck to paycheck, hence most people don't have the luxury of losing a job and taking a nice month-long vacation before starting something else.

Re:It's really the company's decision

[ILongForDarkness]

Or even better a time bomb for half way through your notice period. If they treat you fairly delete it. If they are pricks you won't be able to login to disable it.