Leopard Upgraders Getting "Blue Screen of Death" 542
Z80xxc! writes "Some Mac users upgrading to Apple's new Leopard operating system are encountering long delays on reboot — an experience they liken to the Windows 'Blue Screen of Death.' While some of those upgrading were able to access their computer after waiting for as long as several hours, others were forced to do a complete reinstall. Some suspect that a framework called 'Application Enhancer' by Unsanity LLC may be causing the problem, but there has been no official word from Apple at this point."
Biggest problem so far is airport disks (Score:2, Informative)
In addition Apple have pulled support for time machine on airport disks in the last minute. Big stinker. It's bad enough that Aperture can't use airport disks for vaults...
Re:Archive and install (Score:5, Informative)
Then restore the data from the backup drive, erase the backup drive and then you can turn on time machine.
See, those years of doing Windows upgrades finally paid off for something
Or, if you actually get the blue screen:
1. Reboot into single-user mode (hold Cmd-S while booting machine)
2. Follow the directions OSX gives you when you get to the prompt (I think these were them - just type the two commands it tells you to):
fsck -fy /
3. Remove the following files:
rm -rf
rm -rf
rm -rf
rm -rf
4. Exit, to continue booting normally
exit
Via: http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1195031&tstart=0 [apple.com]
Re:Archive and install (Score:5, Informative)
- Plain old upgrade. Just lays down the new OS on top of the old one
- Archive and install. Takes a backup of your current stuff, lays down a clean OS, and recovers your stuff from the backup it made
- Erase and install. Erases the disk/partition, and installs the OS.
(2) or (3) are the best option. I use (3) because my home directory is on a different disk to my boot disk, and I did that on purpose so I could do nice clean installs. (2) works well too though.
the offical word from unsanity is it's broken (Score:5, Informative)
http://www.wire-heads.com/istrip/index.php?strip_id=26
Leopard install with Application Enhancer (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Archive and install (Score:5, Informative)
It also moves all your preference settings and fonts to another folder, and cleans out the startup items list. (fonts and preferences are the only two things that normally leak beyond the app container (there's a few other exceptions for special apps, but as a rule installing an app does not barf all over your computer with DLLs and Registry hooks. On macs, the OS polls the App in Applications folder for its capabilities and files it likes to open, so the app does not need to modify a registry. as a result unistalls are normally as simple as dragging the app out of the application folder.
So after an archive and install you drag back the things you want to keep. The only hassle is sometimes you need to look for the associated preference setting which is where most apps store their activation key.
A few non apple apps behave linux like and shove things into
Rumor was that apple worked hard to make the non-archive and install mode (update) smart enough to remove all the bad crap and leave the okay crap. Apparently not!
But if it is APE then well then that's kinda understandable its the singlemost invasive kernel mod of all.
Safe Mode (Score:5, Informative)
There is no need to reinstall when something can be removed easily with a safe boot. Too bad Apple doesn't talk up safe booting more so people will know it is there.
Clean Install (Score:3, Informative)
Any time there is a major OS version, it's foolhardy to 'Upgrade' in that there is no way for the vendor (in this case Apple) to possibly test for each potential configuration. While it's true that this may make the move to a new platform base take longer (with needed software reinstallation) it's the best way to ensure a smooth transition, and also assist the end-user AND the software vendors in question to bug squash.
It's easy to point fingers, and the upgrade process should in truth be discontinued altogether (imco) and rather provide utilities that will help a user migrate personal settings and preferences to a new build via a back-up utility of some type. To be fair, Apple does a GREAT job by providing the archive and install method which goes half-way but does not provide the opportunity to 'archive and clean install' which would be the ideal case.
For myself, I can't wait to step into the time machine, and also get the new features available in the OS X Server product.
Boot verbosely (Score:5, Informative)
Of course, I'm a cli guy
How is this anything like a BSOD? (Score:3, Informative)
best practices (Score:3, Informative)
2) do not let the install do a straight upgrade, use the archive and install option or erase/install if you have reliable backups and can afford a little risk and a little more work
3) remove any programs that integrate themselves with the OS (hint: these will often add new preference options to the system preferences pane). These programs almost always have issues during an upgrade and are often not supported right away by new operating systems due to their nature.
These are just some basic guidelines, but if you have any specific questions or concerns, ask Apple and search for answers prior to installation. Not rocket science, but most users have never upgraded their own OS before and Apple makes it appear that anyone can do it without the slightest worry. That's close to the truth, but not close enough.
This seems like pilot error. (Score:3, Informative)
If you're doing an upgrade to the OS, and you're using any third party system extensions, you remove them before you upgrade. That's pretty basic.
Re:jesus h christ (Score:5, Informative)
However, recently Logitech has started using APE as a part of their driver package for their mice and keyboards, in effect installing something known to cause headaches behind people's backs.
Therefore the many people that use Logitech products may have APE without explicitly having installed it.
Either way, I can hardly see how Apple is at fault.
Re:Actually, it may work (Score:1, Informative)
Re:Archive and install (Score:3, Informative)
The only thing I've changed is the 3D dock to a 2D dock. It looks nicer...even nicer than the old dock. I'm one of the few it seems to really like the new Stacks feature, but I understand the gripes of others that used nested folders (I never did). I love the new Finder and Spotlight...even though I'll still be using Quicksilver. Spaces is useful for me so far. All my applications are up and running with no problems.
The new Mail and Safari are VERY fast. Opening Mail now is instant now. Again, another "feeling" description: everything feels faster. I know, there's really no way to quantify that statement, but Leopard does seem to have sped up my system.
But hey, there are always problems in upgrading an OS. Does anyone remember when Apple came out with Tiger? Everyone was coming out of the woodwork saying "I'm sticking with Panther".
Re:Archive and install (Score:5, Informative)
But don't you have to then reinstall all of your apps? That's like Win98 logic.
Re:Funny (Score:5, Informative)
If you had Linux apps that worked the way APE does, it would bring down the entire system, too. The only reason you don't is that Linux doesn't have a community of people who long for the olden days of Mac OS 9. I'll explain.
Back in Mac OS 9, apps didn't have protected memory, and thus you could write extensions to the OS that quite literally rewrote parts of applications and the OS itself. Mac OS X uses a more proper model like Linux. However, some people still want to do those sorts of mods to the OS. The result was that the Unsanity folks created APE. APE basically sits down at the linker level and starts an additional thread with its own code running inside the address space of the target application. This thread then loads plug-ins that modify the behavior of the app.
You should immediately see the problem with this. You have a bunch of people who don't have anything to do with the author of an application writing code that mass-modifies dozens of applications, libraries, etc., essentially doing binary patching on the running OS. There's no other phrase to describe this other than mind-bogglingly dangerous. In a biological comparison, it's like rewriting the genetic code of the entire planet using only a single person as a template---as soon as you hit a person with slightly different biology, the patch goes completely wrong. Similarly, when APE tries to operate on new versions of the OS, new versions of applications, new versions of frameworks and libraries, etc., it tends to result in cutting a path of destruction rather than enhancing anything.
What blows my mind is that APE isn't smart enough to check the OS version and NOT LOAD. It is truly unbelievable. How hard is it to say if [ "$(sw_vers -productVersion | sed -E 's/([0-9]+\.[0-9]+)\..*/\1/')" != "10.4" ] ; then syslog -s "unknown OS version." ; exit 0; fi? Every OS release, APE causes some sort of major problem for a lot of users. Every OS release, people just keep coming back and reinstalling it even after seeing the fallout. I just don't get it. It's like Stockholm Syndrome or something....
IMHO, the Unsanity team should be taken out and beaten with wet noodles until the mere sight of a Chinese restaurant causes them to have nightmares for a year.
Unsanity's APE is a nasty hack (Score:4, Informative)
The Unsanity hacks have been a source of trouble for many users for several years. Unsanity has vehemently denied that their products are the trouble, and by a twisted piece of logic, it is the application itself which is misbehaving when things go wrong. It's not hard to find heated discussions of these things on message boards and sites like versiontracker.com and macupgrade.com. The source of the disagreements might be related to how long a person leaves an application open, with the probability of mayhem increasing with time since launch. These remarks relate to pre-Leopard versions of the OS; it seems that Unsanity is finally caught with their pants down and no place to crap.
Re:Archive and install (Score:5, Informative)
3. Remove the following files:
rm -rf "/Library/Preference Panes/Application Enhancer.prefpane"
rm -rf "/Library/Frameworks/Application Enhancer.framework"
rm -rf "/System/Library/SystemConfiguration/Application Enhancer.bundle"
rm -rf "/Library/Preferences/com.unsanity.ape.plist"
Re:Application Enhancer is trouble (Score:5, Informative)
I'm not aware of anything quite as straightforward as copying files to an external hard drive and copying them back, but with Ubuntu it goes something like this:
Then on the new system: Then Ubuntu goes back to the repositories and grabs everything again.Re:Funny (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Funny (Score:5, Informative)
You meant why doesn't APE do this?
SInt32 vers = 0;
err = Gestalt(gestaltSystemVersion, &vers);
if (err or (vers >= 0x1050))
{
return paramErr;
}
(which I just took from the APE source code).
Re:come on, Apple, move into the 21st century (Score:3, Informative)
Re:APE is *not* a kernel mod. (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Oh, irony... (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Archive and install (Score:5, Informative)
When you drag an application from a disk image to anywhere on the system, Apple's launch services register the application, based on the configuration within the application bundle. It has nothing to do with the
Re:Archive and install (Score:3, Informative)
He probably has all of his vendor applications in ~/Applications, or /Shared/Applications, which are on the partition he's keeping alive.
Re:Archive and install (Score:5, Informative)
1) Grab application or directory off
2) Grab plists from ~/Library/Preferences
3) Copy any related resources from
4) Check in
About 90% of applications are fully migrated after step 1)
This doesn't cover drivers or other wierdness like PreferencePanes, but those are usually stand alone files that can be copied over.
Re:Archive and install (Score:3, Informative)
What you wrote above, I can apply to Windows just about as well.
I can usually copy the Program's directory, fish out the major Registry entries, and for some of the more complicated programs fish out their DLLs pretty easily.
The only time I really run into trouble is with certain pieces of software that actually fingerprint the machine during install
Re:Archive and install (Score:5, Informative)
If you're going to criticize something it helps if you have the slightest clue what you're talking about. Try actually using a Mac sometime, you might be pleasantly surprised.
There's nothing special about the
By contrast, Windows applications have a tendency to sprawl over the hard drive, copying things into shared system-wide resource directories because that is how a library is registered in the windows world. The windows start menu is used to cut through what would otherwise be a very cluttered place, the "\Program Files" directory.
On the Mac the equivalent, "/Applications" contains the actual application in it's entirety. Again; in contrast linking applications into the Start Menu is one of the many functions of an installer in Windows. Without installers you wouldn't have any idea where the application went and would have to navigate the troubled waters of "\Program Files" alone.
The other magic usually handled by installers in Windows happens when you first load an application, at which point it exchanges information with the OS, the OS from that point on knows where on the disk the application is so that even if you move it around the filesystem hierarchy it will still be able to find it, it also exchanges information about what mimetypes the app would like to be associated with so that it can show up in the "open with..." list for certain file types and declare itself able to handle any types of files it might create.
If you need to register system services, then you need an application installer or a monkey willing to do it by hand (a user, for example). In that case mac applications install like Windows ones, by using an installer package.
Comment removed (Score:4, Informative)
The problem IS caused by Application Enhancer (Score:5, Informative)
There's no suspicion about it; that's exactly what's causing the problem. Application Enhancer is an input manager, and input managers are no longer supported in Leopard. People installing it knew the risks they were taking when they installed it on Tiger. Instructions have already been posted online on how to remove Application Enhancer from the command-line.
Sorry, there's no big "BSOD" error in Leopard's install. It's a hacky piece of software people shouldn't have been installing in the first place.
20 and counting..... (Score:5, Informative)
Thats 10 G5's and 4 Mac Pro's with upgrades.
Thats 4 MacBook Pros reformats.
Thats 2 Powerbooks with archive and install.
You can mod me any way you like, but it wont change the success I've had with Leopard....Awesome.
Two installs - both golden! (Score:2, Informative)
It should be no surprise to many Mac users that each build does break/improve things that may not have been explicitly allowed in earlier builds. Unlike the non-Mac OS worlds, Apple is still the final arbiter on what does and does not make it on their OS.
Re:how to conveniently backup an OS X system? (Score:2, Informative)
2. Download Carbon Copy Cloner (donationware) or SuperDuper (even unpaid/unregistered, it can perform basic cloning).
3. Clone the boot volume to a sufficiently large partition on the external. You can clone the boot volume while you're booted from it (which was a refreshing change from having to make boot floppies when I used Ghost with Windows), though it's a good idea to quit all other applications while the clone runs.
The only option I'm aware of to compress a cloned OS X volume would be to clone it to a compressed disk image using Disk Utility or the Apple Software Restore command line tool. It takes a fairly long time and is a two-pass process (i.e., it images, and then compresses the image), so I don't usually bother with compression. I make uncompressed read/write images, and if I need to boot from one I clone it to a real external hard drive partition.
If you want to clone frequently, cough up the $28 for SuperDuper. It has a 'smart update' feature that only copies changed files after the initial clone, so subsequent clone jobs finish much more quickly. You can also schedule jobs with the paid version.
FYI, Carbon Copy Cloner can be used to make a shell script to clone the volume. If you really want to you can make a launchd item that will run that script automatically when you connect the external drive.
Re:Archive and install (Score:2, Informative)
Only if you ignore the part where he wrote that 90% of the time you're done after step one. (I think it's not quite that high, but it's often the case.)
Re:I had the spinning ball of death (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Archive and install (Score:3, Informative)
Or it needs to be dropped into somewhere on PATH, or PATH needs to be modified to include the directory. If you want it accessible by ProgID, then you need to do regsvr32 or the api equiv.
None of these options require dropping files into system-wide resource directories.
Re:Archive and install (Score:4, Informative)
Escape your spaces! (Score:3, Informative)
fsck -fy /
mount -uw /
rm -rf
rm -rf
rm -rf
rm
exit
Like that.
Bonus tip for shell newbies:
The default shell in Mac OS X supports tab-completion. For one of those "rm" commands, start typing "rm -rf
Comment removed (Score:3, Informative)
Re:APE is *not* a kernel mod. (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Funny (Score:4, Informative)
http://www.unsanity.org/archives/haxies/leopard.php [unsanity.org]
Personally, I think APE and the Unsanity haxies are %$^%$ and I stay as far away from them as I can!
Re:Archive and install (Score:3, Informative)
Liberated from Windows since 2005 thanks to OSx86.
Re:Archive and install (Score:4, Informative)
On Windows, most file type associations are done by installers. Occasionally the app itself does them when it's launched (many people object to that unless it's optional though). Either way, they are stored in the registry as a path to the EXE. If you move it, the link breaks. If you copy the app to a new system, the link doesn't exist.
On a Mac, as soon as the system sees the app (regardless of where it is), you can open file types that belong to it with a double click. It's been like that for decades, so yes, in this regard, it is easier on a Mac.
As for the other support files, it's a little more complicated. On Windows, you have DLLs that are sometimes in the app's folder, but are often in the
On a Mac, they may be in a few places too, but usually they are pretty obvious. They are often found in appropriately named folders either the Application Support or Preferences folders in either
So, again, it's a little easier.
On a Mac, you could even rename the
Personally, I don't think OS X outshines Windows in most cases, but these are the kinds of things it does do very well.
*Everything except Apple's own Software Updates, although most people would consider this a bug. Apps and file type associations would still work though.
Re:Archive and install (Score:2, Informative)
Windows user:
Pulls down an application, extracts it and runs it, and voila, said application is now registered with the OS and can be used for handling that file type.
Sean
Re:Archive and install (Score:3, Informative)
The post you replied to here was correcting a factual error in the grandparent, and suggesting that the poster take his own advice about not mouthing off about things you dont know much about.