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Spam IT

Has Microsoft 'Solved' Spam? 337

MsWillow writes to tell us the Seattle PI is running a story looking back at Bill Gates promise to have the spam problem "solved" in two years. Well, it looks like time is up, and the verdict is -- an emphatic "maybe". From the article: "Microsoft says it sees things differently. To "solve" the problem for consumers in the short run doesn't require eliminating spam entirely, said Ryan Hamlin, the general manager who oversees the company's anti-spam programs. Rather, he said, the idea is to contain it to the point that its impact on in-boxes is minor. In that way, Hamlin said, Gates' prediction has come true for people using the right tactics and advanced filtering technology."
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Has Microsoft 'Solved' Spam?

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  • A Plan for Spam (Score:5, Informative)

    by eldavojohn ( 898314 ) * <eldavojohn@gma[ ]com ['il.' in gap]> on Monday January 23, 2006 @09:42AM (#14538464) Journal
    I scoff at Bill Gates' "efforts" to reduce spam. What has he done precisely?

    Probably just deferred the responsibility to one of his underlings. Aside from that, he talks about crazy methods such as deciding how much money the sender has to pay you before you open the e-mail [cbsnews.com].

    Gates has plenty [microsoft.com] of articles [microsoft.com] which detail how much he hates spam. Anyone can sit down and write this, but Gates gets the high exposure interviews with the Wall Street Journal and the AP.

    Gates is all talk. If you want to read some articles from some very interesting people, check out A Plan for Spam [paulgraham.com] by Paul Graham. It talks about simple ways to write Bayesian spam filters and does a very good job at describing how they work. Another valuable member of the anti-spam community is Jonathon Zdziarski [nuclearelephant.com] who has written many books about how to actually get rid of spam. You can also read the Slashdot interview [slashdot.org] with him.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Monday January 23, 2006 @09:44AM (#14538479)
    The word is viruses. We're speaking English, not Latin. And that would be wrong in Latin also. Should be viri if we were speaking Latin. I know, fighting a losing battle.
  • Paul Graham (Score:3, Informative)

    by putko ( 753330 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @09:47AM (#14538503) Homepage Journal
    I thought that Paul Graham and some other folks, solved this problem with Bayesian filtering.

    Paul Graham has a famous essay, A Plan For Spam: http://www.paulgraham.com/spam.html [paulgraham.com]
  • Re:My Hotmail Inbox (Score:1, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday January 23, 2006 @09:50AM (#14538525)
    Gmail, on the other hand, has spam filters that actually work. I get about 1 spam message in my inbox each week, while the other 75 or so are in my spam filter, and I think I've had a total of one message ever incorrectly marked as spam.

    If efficient filters were what it was to "solve" spam, than Google has come pretty close.

    -TCM
  • Re:In short... (Score:2, Informative)

    by j-cloth ( 862412 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @09:51AM (#14538528)
    And one of those strategies is to use any system other than the MS system. Have you used IMF on Exchange? On mine, about 90% of the spam still gets through and about 60% of what is caught is false positive. And the only tuning possible is ever increasing white/blacklists.
  • by Deviant ( 1501 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @09:53AM (#14538548)
    Actually Microsoft has done far more than anybody else in helping me with Spam. The spam filter for Outlook 2003 is very good and Office Update regularly provides updates to the filter that bring it up to date with some of the latest major sources/types to look for. I set it up a level in how aggressive it is, which has resulted in a false positive or two every now and again, and I have not seen any spam in my inbox in some time.

    Don't knock MS on spam until you see Outlook 2003's spam filter. The question becomes if they have the technology that they do in Outlook then why can't the incorporate it into hotmail as well? I would ask the same question about Exchange but I guess they figure most people using an Exchange server are doing it with Outlook.
  • by wertarbyte ( 811674 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @09:58AM (#14538584) Homepage

    Should be viri if we were speaking Latin.

    No, "virus" is not of male gender like "dominus", but neuter like "domus". Therefore, the correct plural should be "virus", with a long "u". But I only barely survived my latin lessons, so I would not count on it.

  • by bbzzdd ( 769894 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @10:20AM (#14538774)

    I thought Gates' solution was to have SMTP senders solve a simple math equation from each mail item they wished to post to a server, thus causing spammers a massive slowdown.

    To the best of my knowledge this solution is not in practice and Microsoft is using Bayesian filtering which way predates Bill's promise.

  • Re:A Plan for Spam (Score:0, Informative)

    by willie3204 ( 444890 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @10:25AM (#14538829)
    I run Exchange 2003 SP2 with IMFv2.0 built in and I have not seen a spam in weeks. I also run the Antigen counterpart for Spam and Anti Virus. The majority of emails is caught by IMF though. He has done THAT much. And I am very happy with the results.
  • by aug24 ( 38229 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @10:57AM (#14539070) Homepage
    How would you know that an email is a reply?

    You're a computer engineer and you don't know about the "In-Reply-To" smtp header?

    I don't know whether I'm being Informative or Flamebait here...

    Justin.

  • by shaka ( 13165 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @11:03AM (#14539111)
    How would you know that an email is a reply?

    Using the In-Reply-To: header flag, perhaps? It uses the unique Message-Id. That's how threading works (in good MUAs - Thunderbird has it's own very very strange message threading). Save the message-id for outgoing e-mails, for each user. When a message is received, match the In-Reply-To header against the list of Message-Ids. If it's there, whitelist.

    Easy.
  • by shancock ( 89482 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @11:04AM (#14539118)
    I agree with Microsoft on this. I have been using http://pobox.com/ [pobox.com] for some time now and the results are dramatic. With their filters I can log in and view messages that were rejected and those that are held for review, and have the option of releasing false-negatives and putting them on my whitelist. I still get 5 or 6 spams a day but I can handle this easily. The rejects are in the thousands sometimes. This all happens before the email gets to my email account. Pobox.com is a forwarding service. Mail for me goes there and then is sent to wherever I wish (up to 3 redirects).

    Any program that can make the impact minimal is IMHO - as the article says - the ojbective. I can deal with some junk mail, I just don't want to spend any significant time cleaning it all up. What pobox.com does not get, gmail usually picks it up and places it in my spam folder. Nice. If Microsoft can do this then I think they are on the right track.
  • by flosofl ( 626809 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @12:04PM (#14539588) Homepage
    chomping at the bit

    Champing! Champing at the bit! God, that drives me insane when people say "chomping". Not only is "chomping" wrong, it's also sounds stupid.

    Champing [m-w.com]

    It's almost as bad as that non-sensical word: irregardless.
  • by Tim C ( 15259 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @12:48PM (#14540063)
    That would be the correct solution, but there's a problem - neither Outlook nor Outlook Express honour the In-Reply-To header. So while it would work for properly-written MUAs, neither of MS's own desktop apps would be able to use the feature. Also, given that they have no understanding of the header, I'd be surprised if Hotmail itself did.
  • by VlartBlart ( 948166 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @01:02PM (#14540235) Journal
    Yeah - and Mr Gates is going to solve world hunger by 2006...

    May be a bit off topic but I have an anonymous email site - is this considered spam? The recipient didn't ask for the email so I guess it is. If this is the case then should these kind of sites be illegal too? Then what about e-card sites?

    Did a quick google on definition of spam and got this:

    To indiscriminately send unsolicited, unwanted, irrelevant, or inappropriate messages, especially commercial advertising in mass quantities. Noun: electronic "junk mail".
  • by flithm ( 756019 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @01:22PM (#14540514) Homepage
    Virii is just plain incorrect.

    To quote the wikipedia [wikipedia.org]: viri and virii are virtually unknown in edited prose, and no major dictionary recognizes them as alternative forms... The virii form would not have been a correct plural, since the -ii ending only occurs in the plural of words ending in -ius. For instance, take radius, plural radii: the root is radi-, with the singular ending -us and the plural -i. Thus the plural virii is that of the nonexistent word virius. The viri form is also incorrect in Latin. The ending -i is used only for masculine nouns, not neuter ones such as virus; moreover, viri (albeit with a short i in the first syllable) is the plural of vir, and means "men".

    Really only people who don't know much about malware, or who don't have a very good grasp on the english language will be seen using the incorrect viri or virii.

    I know you were making a point, and it's a good one... I just wanted to make sure he understands that neither viri nor virii are any kind of correct variant of the word virus.

    The correct form is definitely: viruses.
  • by SpryGuy ( 206254 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @01:23PM (#14540527)
    I have to say, since someone here pointed me to K9, and since installing it and spending a couple of weeks "training it", I almost don't notice spam any more. It's awesome. I must get over 100 spam emails a day (easily), but I can't remember the last time one got through (or the last time a legitimate email got snagged).

    If you haven't tried K9, and you aren't happy with your current spam solution, give it a try...
  • by sepski ( 549852 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @01:56PM (#14540948)
    Sender policy framework [openspf.org] is a system to prevent fake sender address in emails. it works [openspf.org] by checking the claimed sender domain, in the email, against a TXT record in the DNS system. The TXT record contains information of ip's or hostnames, allowed to send email on behalf of the domain in question.
    If the email have a faked sender address it can be bounced or labeled suspicious.

    This works amazingly well, and stops all faked sender emails before it's accepted in the server. Effectivly blocking virus and spam sent with forged addresses. Non exsisting domains are allready blocked in the mail servers so if everyone owning a domain was to implement [openspf.org] this. It would make me a very happy person. Ofcouse spammers can still send email from domains under their own control, but those go into online blacklists [google.com] fairly quickly

    Unfortunatly it does not have the widest accept yet, but growing all the time. After hotmail implemented it in their DNS records, spam is at an all time low around here. Not getting a single spam email from faked hotmail addresses in ages.
    And only 6 months ago I had a dedicated "sent from hotmail" folder since it was 99% likly to be spam anyway...

    sepski
  • by mathmathrevolution ( 813581 ) on Monday January 23, 2006 @01:59PM (#14540992)
    I don't know where a guy who writes "poncy" gets off criticizing other people's vocabulary. The word is Ponzi and using it to mean "fraudulent" is really stretching it.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Monday January 23, 2006 @02:14PM (#14541133)
    The word is poncy, and is a British slang word roughly meaning pretentious.

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