Apple is 'Decentralizing Out of Silicon Valley' (9to5mac.com) 90
9to5Mac writes:
Amid pushback regarding Apple's plans to return to in-person work this fall, Mark Gurman at Bloomberg reports that Apple is "ramping up efforts to decentralize out of Silicon Valley." In the latest edition of his Power On newsletter, Gurman reports that Apple has faced a variety of problems recruiting and retaining talent because of its emphasis on Silicon Valley.
Gurman writes that Apple has been "losing talent" because of the high-cost of living in the San Francisco Bay Area. "Many engineers lamented that they couldn't balance living expenses with other pursuits like college tuition for their children and long-term savings," Gurman says.
Furthermore, Apple has struggled to diversify its workforce because of its focus on Silicon Valley. It also competes with a variety of companies for talent, including Amazon, Google, and Netflix. The cost of operations is also high, and Gurman writes that "Apple could get the same work out of employees demanding far lower salaries in less pricey regions." For these reasons, Apple is reportedly looking to decentralize out of Silicon Valley.
From Bloomberg's report: Decentralization across the company is entering full swing, and Apple has engaged in a costly expansion from the sunny coasts of LA and San Diego to the Pacific Northwest of Oregon and Washington, the Rocky Mountains of Colorado, Iowa's Midwest, the Eastern Seaboard of Massachusetts, Miami and New York. Notably, it's also spending $2 billion on building new campuses in Austin, Texas, and North Carolina. That's in addition to hiring engineers in Canada, Germany, New Zealand, Spain and the U.K. Altogether, the moves will add tens of thousands of jobs outside of Silicon Valley.
As it keeps moving beyond Silicon Valley, Apple will pilot a hybrid office and remote work arrangement globally when it forces nearly all staff back to its offices in September.
Gurman writes that Apple has been "losing talent" because of the high-cost of living in the San Francisco Bay Area. "Many engineers lamented that they couldn't balance living expenses with other pursuits like college tuition for their children and long-term savings," Gurman says.
Furthermore, Apple has struggled to diversify its workforce because of its focus on Silicon Valley. It also competes with a variety of companies for talent, including Amazon, Google, and Netflix. The cost of operations is also high, and Gurman writes that "Apple could get the same work out of employees demanding far lower salaries in less pricey regions." For these reasons, Apple is reportedly looking to decentralize out of Silicon Valley.
From Bloomberg's report: Decentralization across the company is entering full swing, and Apple has engaged in a costly expansion from the sunny coasts of LA and San Diego to the Pacific Northwest of Oregon and Washington, the Rocky Mountains of Colorado, Iowa's Midwest, the Eastern Seaboard of Massachusetts, Miami and New York. Notably, it's also spending $2 billion on building new campuses in Austin, Texas, and North Carolina. That's in addition to hiring engineers in Canada, Germany, New Zealand, Spain and the U.K. Altogether, the moves will add tens of thousands of jobs outside of Silicon Valley.
As it keeps moving beyond Silicon Valley, Apple will pilot a hybrid office and remote work arrangement globally when it forces nearly all staff back to its offices in September.
lol (Score:3, Funny)
Apple says that Silicon Valley is the CORE of its recruitment problems. Apple needs to SEED offices in other cities. Apple will PEEL off some of it's more expensive operations.
Core of Apple (Score:5, Funny)
Apple says that Silicon Valley is the CORE of its recruitment problems.
You know that the core is the part of the apple that you throw away, right?
Re:California slated to be nuked? (Score:4, Insightful)
Wow, welovetrump, the biggliest reliable news source for complete retard nut jobs.
I wouldn't trust the date on that site.
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You know that the core is the part of the apple that you throw away, right?
Isn't that exactly why they designed and implemented M1; to rid themselves of the Core?
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The simple truth is that your workforce does not want to stay in one location. thus you need offices in Paris, Berlin, Kuala Lumpur....
To the Pacific Northwest (Score:5, Funny)
Time to put up the signs [postimg.cc].
Lower salaries? Higher profits. (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Lower salaries? Higher profits. (Score:4, Interesting)
>Even less
You make it sound like they're being cheap.
My buddy at Apple made $250k last year and can't afford to own a home in the San Jose area that isn't complete and total shit. His rent is $3k a month for a home big enough for two adults, one kid, and two (old) cars. Apple and others aren't paying enough for the area not because they aren't paying a fuckton, but because the area is absolutely insane. Sky-high taxes and even higher property values. A home in western states that costs $750k would be $5M in his area and wouldn't come with the acre+ of land.
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I dont' want the land. But most of the more affordable places tend to have standalone houses with yards to mow (not wanted in retirement), or else rental apartments. Don't see the point of "land" myself if you're not farming or using it for something. If you want to garden, a small plot is sufficient. Condos and the like tend to be rarer outside of larger cities. I did buy about 20 years ago, I don't maintain it well and it wasn't all that great to begin with. What gets you priced out is being on a sing
Re:Lower salaries? Higher profits. (Score:5, Insightful)
People like you are weird to me. I will never understand the desire for a New York City style life.
The purpose of land is to have a place for your kids and pets to play ALL THE TIME, without having to leave your home. You don't have to landscape your yard into a giant field of grass. There are plenty of other options that include wooded areas. Go look at some playgrounds in parks that use recycled rubber mulch that looks just like regular mulch.
Condo living sucks ass because you have to deal with a-hole neighbors. If you aren't dealing with an a-hole neighbor, then you probably ARE the a-hole neighbor. When you own at least 1/4 acre with a detached house on it, you don't have to bother your neighbors when you want to listen to music or watch a movie.
The other reason to own land is to not have to deal with stupid HOA boards. If you "buy" land in an HOA, you don't actually own shit. They own you.
Network effect (Score:5, Insightful)
People like you are weird to me. I will never understand the desire for a New York City style life.
Opportunity, especially financial opportunity, is subject to network effects. People move to the city because that's where all the opportunities are.
If you want to switch jobs, chances are there's another one nearby so that you don't have to move. If you're an artist, there's more chance of finding patrons. If you're an entrepreneur, there's more chance of finding partners that match your needs, or funding.
There's more chance of meeting important people in your field, and who can help you along in your career.
Networking can be very useful in the city.
(I completely agree with your sentiment, but I also note that my own opportunities became more limited once I bought a house in a small community.)
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Density is convenient. Montreal is lower-key than New York, but I can walk literally everywhere I need to go about 95% of the time. I'm next to one of the biggest parks in the city, and as a cyclist I never lack for greenspaces. I've also lived in Edmonton, and that city is like one giant suburb. Everyone has a yard, and the schoolyards are about the same size as most of Montreal's city parks. The downside is you have to drive fucking everywhere, even the convenience store for a slurpee, because the tradeof
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People like you are weird to me. I will never understand the desire for a New York City style life.
As someone who grew up in the country, I hated it. 30 miles to the nearest store. Nothing to do. Utilities are hard to get. No technology and lot's of a-hole rednecks you have to deal with. Never going back.
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You know who got the majority of COVID-19 cases? People living in cities. You know who woke up last weekend as they were being sandwiched to death between the floor and ceiling? Condo dwellers in Miami.
I'll stick to my 1/4 acre single-family suburban tract home with woods behind me. Oh and the $1,000/mo I pay for my mortgage and taxes is less than 10% of my gross.
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Oh and my 36 mile commute only takes about 40 minutes where I live.. no traffic... reverse commute out to the boonies.
City life sucks...
Re:Lower salaries? Higher profits. (Score:4, Insightful)
Show up to work at 10 and leave at 7, it's fine.
Showing up at work at 10 and leaving at 7 is far from fine. You really have no morning because you sleep in a little and you are driving right out. You really have no evening because after you leave at 7 and maybe get something to eat, it's 8:30pm by the time you get home, and have very little time in the evening before you have to go to bed.
I know, I've tried that schedule before and it sucks if you have any kind of home life. I'd rather add fifteen minutes to a commute each day and at least have some realistic amount of time in the evening to do stuff.
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I worked 10:00 - 6:00 for years and it was great. It shaved my commute across Boston to Watertown down from 45 - 90 minutes to ~30 minutes (i.e. if I left work between 5 and 6, I would get home at around the same time, on average). I got home at 6:30, play with my daughter for an hour or two, put her to bed, and eat a European style dinner with my wife between 9 and 10. Then I could stay up until 12 or 1 doing whatever and wake up around 8 the next day and be fine to start again.
When I was younger it mea
Re:Lower salaries? Higher profits. (Score:5, Informative)
250K is 20K/month. 3K/month is 15% of gross earnings for a home that supports a small family. Your buddy isn't struggling and you are whining.
Re:Wesley Snipes, is that you?? (Score:4, Insightful)
"gross" in the context above means before taxes. Standard personal finance advice says anything below 30% of gross income is good, 15% is an insanely good spot to be in, in any city in the US.
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Literally no one claimed there is wisdom in it. You're just disputing the straw man you created.
However, you are also making some very wrong assumptions, or are very misinformed.
Recommendations based of gross income don't come from "the industry" they come from government and economists. Here's a bit of history, straight from census.gov:
https://www.census.gov/housing... [census.gov]
Re:Wesley Snipes, is that you?? (Score:4, Interesting)
So, let's assume they take half of his money in taxes (which they don't). He's still only hitting 30%.
250k buys you the American Dream in any city. If you've fucked up your situation so bad that 250k won't cut it, that only reflects on the mismanagement of your own finances. Maybe stop having a new kid and new car every year, buying the wife expensive jewelery and overpriced vacations.
But truth be told you can still even do those things, within reason. Even assuming a 50% tax rate, $3k/mo rent, and an unemployed wife, that leaves $88k for discretionary spending. Double the median household income, to spend on commodities that cost the same in CA as they do everywhere else.
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>So, let's assume they take half of his money in taxes (which they don't).
You're right. They don't. They take more.
Maybe you've never calculated where your money goes. Keep track one year. Be sure to include property tax, sales tax, gas tax, capital gains tax, income tax on bonuses, income (on the discount) + gains on RSUs, FICA + social security (7.65%), additional medicare for over $200k (0.9%), federal income, state income, excise/luxury tax (liquor, beer, etc.). You could include payroll taxes the em
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If you're renting at $3k/mo, your landlord is the one paying the property tax.
Payroll taxes come before you salary, so are not taken out of the $250k figure.
Capital gains are not salary, thus capital gains tax doesn't apply.
Sales and gas taxes might amount to 10%. In my calculation that goes under the $88k of "discretionary spending", as you can choose to buy less junk. (Fun fact: Basic foodstuffs are not subject to sales tax.) But even if you have to pump all $88,000 of that into your gas tank, it only amo
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"Double the median household income, to spend on commodities that cost the same in CA as they do everywhere else."
Sorry but that is not true. Gas alone is $5/gal or more because of all of the pollution control crap they add. Want a single burger from your local fast food shop (no fries or drink)? $8 easy.
Need to hire a babysitter? GL getting anything for under $50 for a few hours. You might not cover the babysitter's parking fees.
When they say the cost of living is higher, they don't just mean the housing.
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If you ever get lucky enough to meet a woman who wants to have a kid with you, you'll realize they're expensive.
The woman or the kid?
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"lol just put $600k down on a $3M home with a monthly mortgage payment of $12.2k and $23.7k a year in property tax, on top of all the other taxes."
You need to be DINK just to afford living in a decent home in that area of CA.
Re: Lower salaries? Higher profits. (Score:1)
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In the vast majority of the USA, 750k for a home is a monstrous amount.
Try like 250k in much of the South for nice homes and even in many built up areas of the northeast you can have a very nice home with a nice size plot of land for well under 500k.
Friend just sold his home in CT with half an acre, beautiful neighborhood and 4500 square foot home w/4 car garage for 350k and was thrilled to get it.
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Re:Lower salaries? Higher profits. (Score:5, Insightful)
Apple (and most employers) aren't paying people enough to live
I have many friends who work for Apple. "Underpaid" is not an adjective I would apply to any of them.
Employees won't be paid enough to cover living expenses, college tuition, etc.
Yet, somehow, people are living in houses and going to college. How is that possible?
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Employees won't be paid enough to cover living expenses, college tuition, etc.
Yet, somehow, people are living in houses and going to college. How is that possible?
Compensation in Silicon Valley is more than enough to cover everything except for a house (assuming that one wants a house in a "good" school area). For those who already have a house, living in Silicon Valley with its relatively higher compensation will result in greater wealth accumulation than living in most other places.
I know quite a few people who are leaving the area because they don't believe they will be able to buy a house. Rightfully or not, part of the reason is that not all but quite a few yo
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Wow... (Score:3, Interesting)
So, let me get this straight: Apple has figured that it can no longer maintain sustainable growth out of hardware sales margins, after-sales repairs, and cheap labour in SEA, and now they want to cut costs on the only thing that actually differentiates them from the competition: the best talent out of the central tech hub in the world. Good luck with that.
I wanna know how they'll deal with their already psycothic corporate secrecy with a distributed R&D workforce... Or maintaining high levels of productivity and cut-throat yearly release schedules without in-person collaboration. Sounds to me this may finally be then dawn of the semi-yearly iPhone.
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In the modern global era, what a technological multinational firm does, is distribute tech divisions across the globe. So a particular division of the corporation located in each major customer country. This so that they are a part of that countries technological base, to give them a lead into all major tech contracts, especially security ones, which countries will absolutely prefer to be done local since the wildly corrupt election of Joe Biden and the various political machinations of the UK government vi
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So, let me get this straight: Apple has figured that it can no longer maintain sustainable growth out of hardware sales margins, after-sales repairs, and cheap labour in SEA, and now they want to cut costs on the only thing that actually differentiates them from the competition: the best talent out of the central tech hub in the world. Good luck with that.
I wanna know how they'll deal with their already psycothic corporate secrecy with a distributed R&D workforce... Or maintaining high levels of productivity and cut-throat yearly release schedules without in-person collaboration. Sounds to me this may finally be then dawn of the semi-yearly iPhone.
What differentiated them from the competition was Steve Jobs. They really haven't done anything ground breaking since. You can code-monkey the next version of iOS with features you stole from Android from anywhere on earth.
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Apparently the Watch sells a lot, and it looks like it is always getting more popular.
Well, that's a switch (Score:2)
Factories in the USA.. Sales in China
Opportunity Cost (Score:1)
Yet can't you support a home in the upper 95th percentile
It's not that you couldn't support a home there on an Apple salary. It's that elsewhere you'd have a much better home, and save way more money towards retirement.
At Apple peopler get a chance to work on stuff that millions of people will use, so that isa big draw... but you give up a lot to do so if you have to live in California.
The campuses in other states should help.
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Except Musk and most other California "expats" are moving to Austin, the most California-esque of Texas cities. Extrapolating from this, the Californian influx looks a bit like a demographic timebomb. They may appreciate the relatively low property values, but they have different expectations for how a state should be run.
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Where the increase of population
1. Will raise the cost of living in Texas.
2. Have rapidly growing towns demanding updated and more expansive expensive infrastructure.
3. Create more densely populated areas creating more crime.
4. Adapt to changing and and more diverse set of cultures.
5. Needing to levy higher taxes to cover the costs
6. Create shortages in power and water supply
7. Increase traffic
8. Require a bunch of news laws to help keep everyone safe
9. Homelessness and poverty for the locals who can no lon
Re:Hope Texas has crime figured out. (Score:4, Interesting)
Have you ever been to Texas? Houston is probably more liberal in a lot of ways than Austin.
I have lived in both Texas and California. I'm starting to believe that the "out of control crime" in California is a myth started by Californians to keep jackoffs like you away. When I lived on the Central Coast, there was virtually no crime, no filth in the streets. Perfect weather every day and a blue ocean and beaches and really nice people. The housing costs were moderately higher but utilities, food and other costs were moderately lower. I'd still be living there but we found an even nicer place (none of your business).
Texas also has really nice people, but the place is so ugly geographically, run so poorly, and the weather is such shit that it's impossible to have any quality of life there. And their gerrymandered government is keeping total assholes like Greg Abbot, Ken Paxton. Texas is governed by the most corrupt and stupid politicians in the United States. And I'm from Chicago, so when I say Texas politicians are more corrupt and stupid, that's saying a lot.
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Have you ever been to Texas? Houston is probably more liberal in a lot of ways than Austin.
I went to college and lived in Houston for a while, don't think that is the case at all...
I have also been to California many, baby times over the last decade and all I can say is you are 100% insane if you think stuff about crime and filth there is made up. Not just in CA but many, many other CA cities as well are suffering. Try going to Venic Beach now... good luck!
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And their gerrymandered government is keeping total assholes like Greg Abbot, Ken Paxton.
How are state-wide elections affected by gerrymandering?
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Well said, and accurate.
Suddenly they'll find out that the whole Texan "we're rugged individualists" thing is fanciful bullshit for any significant number of people who have to live together, whether it's as a city, a state, or a country.
On another note, if the population in Texas increases more than 5 or 10 percent, their electrical grid will fall over regularly and spectacularly. It's barely functioning now, stress it more and it won't work at all. Rolling blackouts and power rationing will be the norm.
.
(
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Just remember, Texas sued the federal government for the right to fuck up their own power grid. Think about that.
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You are right, we'd love to have Texas' electoral votes.
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California is the fifth largest economy in the world but republicans hate it for being successful while being liberal.
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Ya, because Texas isn't stupid: the governor wants to make silencers on handguns legal. That way no one will hear the carnage.
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Ya, because Texas isn't stupid: the governor wants to make silencers on handguns legal. That way no one will hear the carnage.
Silencers on hand guns (and rifles) are legal already in 42 of 50 states. Obviously, California isn't one of them.
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oh so you're an ignorant anti-firearm person.
meanwhile, sound suppression of firearms is healthy thing to do, hunting and target shooting with less hearing damage is a good thing.
Gun crimes with or without "silencers" will be about the same. I doubt gangsters will like buying the nonstandard subsonic ammo and the much longer less concealable handguns with them.
Re: Good riddance to California (Score:3)
Problem of their own making (Score:5, Interesting)
When they built their new headquarters, the UFO, the housing prices around there went crazier. There are simply too many office chairs for the number of bedrooms.
I liked the valley before the megacorps took over. Maybe the oasis of hacker culture and startups will recover if Facebook and Google follow.
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Simply built a lot of condos to sell to its workers, with a nice garage to part their nice Fiat car, and offering a mortgage that they repaid with part of the wage.
These condos aren't the nicest thing nowadays but in the 50s concrete and brick finish was all the rage. But I suppose that nowadays a think like this is considered a terrible eyesore anyway.
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Park their Fiat car? I couldn't help but notice in your photo that there are no repair shops. For that many Fiats there would have to be a lot of repair shops. Fix It Again Tony.
Re:Good (Score:4, Interesting)
Lol, looking forward to MacOS Philadelphia, Baltimore, Orlando, and Camden.
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They better stop being USA-centric as well. They have plenty of cities worldwide, plenty of countries to choose from, plenty of lakes, mountains, planets and galaxies to choose from. Ya know, Think different?
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macOS: OCP Edition.
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MacOS Chicago.
The OS that has a high protective fence around the admin functions (They Mayor's house). Your application data sometimes is burned, looted or murdered. You are the bad guy because you own a Mac. It automatically steals money from your bank accounts and donates it to leftist causes that seek to kill you. If you complain a bunch of people show up to beat you up.
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Lol, looking forward to MacOS Philadelphia, Baltimore, Orlando, and Camden.
When we get MacOS Washington DC it'll be all over.
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Hybrid system is a scam (Score:1)
Will nobody talk about THE EARTHQUAKE? (Score:3)
Somewhat overdue and a very good reason to abandon California...
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... or the crime problems.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1... [twitter.com]
https://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.... [cbslocal.com]
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Sell fast. I know a guy that his entire retirement plan is his house. He bought it in the 1980s. I think today's money he said it's about 20X what he paid for it.
Apple is the new TARGET (Score:2)
Distributed, Distribution and Diversification –Tim’s supply chain to grave AAPL dictums.
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Yeah, I mean, nothing says failed quite like being the wealthiest state in America with the longest life expectancy on the mainland (only Hawaii is higher), and with by far the most graduates.
I mean, yeah, nothing says failed quite like success.
Bitter much red neck?
One point (Score:2)