China Says It Lacks Skills To Hack US Systems 507
ScentCone writes "A spokesman for China's foreign ministry says that — China being the 'developing nation' that it is — he doubts that his country has the sophistication to hack foreign systems. This in response to statements by two congressmen regarding apparent probing by China-based crackers into congressional systems for information about communication between US officials and activists in China."
South Park defense (Score:4, Funny)
Re:South Park defense (Score:4, Informative)
Re:South Park defense (Score:4, Informative)
Thanks (Score:3, Funny)
Also, I notice that between the two of us we've currently received three "+1, Informative" moderations for helping people hear penis jokes in exaggerated accents. Thanks for helping me do my part in making the internet such an amazing informational resource.
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Re:South Park defense (Score:4, Informative)
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"The chinese will say they cannot do something even when they can."
They are just being modest.
Re:South Park defense (Score:5, Funny)
Of course, the really ironic thing would be if the Chinese were hacking the American systems to turn them into zombies to spam out ads for penis enlargement pills.
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China does get into wars (though historically with itself, and is claiming areas taken by the Mongols(Tibet is not historically part of China). Though "The Art of War" advises against fighting, it was not written because of a history of peace.
People started moving out of caves 8,000 years ago, with the
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China is the longest living civilization/culture of earth. I would say that they are the most succesfull example of a civilization that the eyes of the world has ever seen.
In 5k years of empire, they got to fuck arround with most of asia, all the way down to indochina, and all the way to the east till japan.
What they are answering now, comes from a culture that is v
Re:South Park defense (Score:4, Informative)
Re:South Park defense (Score:4, Informative)
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UNderestimating an enemy is stupid. Underestimating the eldest civilization on earth, borders on the insane.
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If you measure success as length of existance, you could say they are the most successful I guess. I think most folks add many more requirements for 'success' however.
China holds a trillion dollars of US debt (Score:5, Interesting)
You should all read Sun Tzu and have a bash at playing "Go" as well.
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Your assumption that democracy is inherently better than dictatorship only holds for your cultural values. All political systems or cultures are better than dystopia and all are worse than utopia, they all have benefits and flaws, yet while there are more similarities than differences we tend to ignore the familiar (including our own flaws) and divide
Re:South Park defense (Score:5, Funny)
The Chinese ARE a great culture with over 5,000 yrs. of recorded history behind them (when the caucasian race was still in caves that people were already culturally & scientifically advanced, by way of comparison), the only OTHER like it, is India, afaik!
I bet the Chinese have a better sense of humor than you.
5,000 years, and yet (Score:3, Funny)
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I'm sure I'm not getting it quite right, but Dennis Miller once pointed out that Eskimos eat blubber not because it's delicious but because it's the only thing on the Arctic buffet. Obviously this is a bit of an exaggeration (they can eat fish on occasion, too) but close enough to the truth for our purposes here today.
If you think the big swinging dicks (figuratively in this case, obviously) running China are eating rice gruel for breakfast, you have another fucking think coming. On the other hand, they're
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And well China is a geographically vast place. Different places have different preferences for breakfast, I'm just talking about the local tradition here.
Re:South Park defense (Score:5, Insightful)
Honestly there are a lot of us- not just Chinese, but all Asians that get pissed off a lot because it's not okay to use the 'n' word or make black jokes or use derogatory terms for Jews or Hispanics- but I hear Gook and Chink and Slant eyed or and every other term in the book thrown around (my favorite was being called "indian nigger" when I was in the midwest) not to mention the lame assed white guy Chinese accent and it's just fine according to society. Honestly as much as I am not a fan of china (my dad escaped after the revolution) I honestly think it's funny that they are kicking our ass economically and love the fact that Japan and South Korea put our tech to shame because we are so afraid to get our heads out of our asses in this country and take anyone seriously who isn't white.
I couldn't believe the other day I was flipping channels and "mind of mencia" was on and he had some rant about how stupid and dirty chinese people were and seriously, I was really offended. I mean if you were to put any other race in that rant of his most people would be angry, but chinese people *pfft* who cares right? they won't complain, they are a "model minority" because they don't say anything and are good at math (which I am not, really- I work in legal tech but have a degree in fine arts and have taught post graduate studies in design and audio composition and engineering).
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China gets in wars/military actions like anyone else, but when they do it, the purpose is to take away freedoms.
Re:South Park defense (Score:4, Insightful)
Of course, that being said, I have no idea what the GP is trying to say in general... (sounds like a rant by a drunken troll on crack) But the precise sentence you quoted is spot on. The point is it seems that people assume that China, when it gets "strong", would involve itself in stupid wars on intangible "ideologies", like "depriving other people of freedom", "anti-democracy", "evil oppression", etc. That's just bullsht.
If China was really that war-mongering, it'd have invaded Taiwan already. Instead, it's going through negotiations to improve cross strait relationships (as long as the Taiwanese government isn't pressing for outright "independence", whatever that means)
Please enlighten me.
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You have another false statement now, too. China is currently attempting an occupation--Tibet.
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US Congress didn't declare war, what they did was that they gave authorization for Bush to use armed forces in defense of USA and for enforcing UN policies. Thus Giving Bush under conditions, the right to send America into war.
Now heres where things get interesting.
Firstly with Iraq, you were not at peace, you simply had a cease-fire arrangement. Peace was never officially declared after the Gulf war in 1990.
Thus by UN standards, USA never started a war, they simpl
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Re:South Park defense (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:South Park defense (Score:5, Insightful)
The only way to win is not to play.
Re:South Park defense (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:South Park defense (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:South Park defense (Score:4, Funny)
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On the other hand, if we closed down the port of Long Beach, China would be bankrupt in a few months.
Well, I suppose we'd also have to refuse to pay back US Treasury Securities owned by the Chinese government.
Hmmm, then we'd probably be bankrupt as well as the world would refuse to purchase any more of our government debt.
Prices at Wal-Mart woul
Re:South Park defense (Score:5, Funny)
so.. (Score:5, Interesting)
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Look, if you're really trying to get nerdy, you're just going to have to go ahead and make some kind of comparison to Star Trek. Just correcting people about South Park isn't going to cut it.
China lacks the skills? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:China lacks the skills? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:China lacks the skills? (Score:4, Informative)
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Re:China lacks the skills? (Score:5, Insightful)
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In America, we even have a game where thats all you do. Its called Pictionary. Except that neither side can speak Chinese or Japanese.
Re:China lacks the skills? (Score:4, Informative)
To English and German, an "A" is an "A" and really does not mean anything in and of itself. The alphabet denotes sounds that when strung together have a meaning.
In Chinese and Japanese, each character has a specific meaning in itself. It is that meaning that carries between both languages - one does not even need to know how to pronounce the character to understand its meaning.
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Depending on the number of Kanji in a piece of Japanese text, I can extract the meaning sometimes better than automatic online translations. I don't know any Japanese, but experience is that most of the important words are written in Kanji, while the Japanese characters are usually there for grammatical purposes.
Usually the problem when reading Japanese is the heavy use of Katakana, due to Japanese adopting a lot of western terms (even for things not
Re:China lacks the skills? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:China lacks the skills? (Score:5, Interesting)
Not to the extent it is elsewhere.
A friend of mine told me a funny story years ago of his parents when they first arrived in the US. His mother received an invitation from the neighbours for a housewarming dinner. When she arrived, the hostess came up to her and suggested she help herself from the buffet. The conversation proceeded along the following lines:
"No, thank you."
"You really must."
"I'm sorry, but I really shouldn't."
"I insist."
"Thank you for your hospitality, but I really can't."
"Ok. Suit yourself, then."
When his mother returned home in tears, her husband asked her what had happened. She said she had never felt so insulted, and didn't eat a thing. When he asked why she didn't eat anything, she replied, "The hostess didn't insist the third time!"
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times they are a changing?
Re:China lacks the skills? (Score:4, Funny)
To attempt to quote an old Mac Davis tune that I remember from the Muppet Show:
Oh Lord it's hard to be humble when you're perfect in every way
I can't wait to look in the mirror 'cause I get better lookin' each day
To know me is to love me, I must be a hell of a man
Oh Lord it's hard to be humble, but I'm doin' the best that I can
Re:China lacks the skills? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:China lacks the skills? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:China lacks the skills? (Score:4, Funny)
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More likely that our intrepid congressmen were engaged in a lengthy session of viewing some "non-work-related sites" (i.e., "browsing porn") and managed to snag a worm. Rather than demonstrate any personal responsibility, they picked the first easy target.
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Bald face liars. (Score:5, Funny)
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Apparentely this foreign minister needs to go back to Marketing 101 - he missed the week where "how to lie convincingly" was taught.
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Gnomes. Looking for underpants.
Re:Bald face liars. (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:Bald face liars. (Score:4, Insightful)
If China actually WERE a developing nation, that stuff wouldn't be so bad. But China has 0 problem throwing its weight around places like Sudan where it uses its ginormous reserves of foreign currency and military know-how to help the Sudanese slaughter their own citizens in exchange for oil.
China, if you want the benefits of being one of the big boys, you are going to have to pay the costs as well. This whole "we are a developing nation when it suits us" bullshit has got to stop, but unfortunately anyone who is actually in a position to make them play by the rules is either a cheater themselves or just so hypnotized by the theoretical promise of China that they refuse to do anything about it.
Developing nations dont have a space program (Score:3, Insightful)
And using thier logic, the USA is also a developing nation. Maybe we are a little more developed, but we still have a way to go and are making progress.
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And what has that got to do with reality? More people believe in God than don't, but that doesn't make God any more factual. Get off your anti-U.S. pulpit for a moment, and grasp that the United States has been far more of a stabilizing factor in world affairs than otherwise. That's because any would-be Hitlers out there know very well what would happen if they tried anything nasty on a significant scale. Nobody but th
Yeah, right (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Yeah, right (Score:5, Interesting)
Not to mention that a lot of the key mathematics that broke MD5 was done by Chinese cryptographers, among quite a few other mathematical and scientific breakthroughs over the last few years. Saying they don't have the capability is absurd.
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There, fixed it.
Re:Yeah, right (Score:5, Informative)
Here's a good site to give you an overview [cryptography.com].
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They are certainly capable. I have here a stack of magazines, dating from 1978. One article shows a Chinese computer designed back then. If China is a developing nation, then so where the US and the USSR in the 1950's.
Could have fooled me.. (Score:2, Funny)
Okay.. flame away
Re:Could have fooled me.. (Score:5, Insightful)
I think your point (intentional or not) is in fact quite valid. In a country of billions how could there not be at least a few with the innate talent needed to accomplish this?
Given, skill and talent are seperate but related things - talent you have or don't, skill you use or lose - yet with the right amount of inherent ability and the drive to learn, what isn't possible?
He then followed... (Score:5, Funny)
I for one... (Score:2, Funny)
Oh yes. One more thing.
*COUGH*BULLSHIT*COUGH*BULLSHIT*COUGH*
Now where were we?
step 1, hide source (Score:5, Informative)
China has large internet user base and the average Jin would likely secure their home machine as well as average Joe across the ocean.
Well... (Score:2, Funny)
whats more likely (Score:2, Interesting)
Seems to me they could use the access to try and steal something they could sell.
If it was an attack, I mean, has there been any evidence released? Or is this just finger pointing in the absence of proof?
Re:whats more likely (Score:4, Informative)
"The extent of the intrusions on Capitol Hill, which officials said began in August 2006, was unclear, although Rep. Frank R. Wolf (R-Va.), whose office had four computers affected, said that other members of Congress were targeted, as well as at least one congressional committee. "They got everything," Wolf said at a news briefing, describing the attack on his office systems.
Wolf said that after one of the attacks, a car with license plates belonging to Chinese officials went to the home of a Chinese dissident in the Washington suburbs and took photographs of it."
Re:whats more likely (Score:5, Insightful)
In spy stories you commit things to memory because they're too dangerous to write down. Have we degenerated to the point where you not only write things down but you put them on the Internet with a big sign saying "steal me?"
Unlikely argument, SW skills are easily developed (Score:2)
uh huh. (Score:2)
If they're not sophisticated enough (Score:5, Insightful)
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Didn't South Africa pull off the exact same feat against some NATO naval forces during an exercise?
If anything, it's probably an indication of just how much Western military forces oversell the effectiveness of high-tech toys.
Re:If they're not sophisticated enough (Score:5, Funny)
Re:If they're not sophisticated enough (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Ah, naivety at its finest (Score:5, Interesting)
No, that's what the Navy said to make the Chinese feel overly confident and to underestimate our ability to track them. Classic move... make your opponent complacent enough that you can then later make them completely doubt their ability to do anything when you rip the rug out from under them, as the situation warrants. Nothing makes people doubt their abilities more than the sudden discovery that they've been completely wrong about their own success. We should know (as should the former Soviets and everyone else), since it's happened to us, too.
Re:Ah, naivety at its finest (Score:5, Funny)
American CO: wait for it
[Chinese sub pops to the surface]
American CO (over radio): Lordy! Where do you come from?
Chinese CO: Where did you come from? I hope I am not interrupting anything?
American CO: Oh, nothing important. You sure surprised me, popping up out of nowhere like that!
Chinese CO: Did I? Please excuse me! We had no idea anybody was up here. We're having a little trouble with our engines!
American CO: Do you need help?
Chinese CO: Any chance you could give us a jump?
[American XO and CO exchange looks]
American CO: Uh, sure, can you take 440 volts?
Chinese CO: One moment, I check with engineer...
[sounds of argument in Chinese]
Chinese CO: So sorry. My Engineer says 440 volt no work!
American XO: That's not right, they should have...
American CO (cutting in): Uh, don't you have an operators manual or something?
Chinese CO: Engineer says cook used pages to wrap leftovers. No problem, I fix
[sound of large spanner being whacked against steel hull of sub]
Chinese CO: Hah! Now engines go!
American CO: That's very amazing! You fixed your boat by whacking the hull with a spanner?
Chinese CO: Oh, yes, you know us primitive Chinamen. Our boats are junk! Get it? Junk! Ha ha!
American XO and CO: Ha ha!
Chinese CO: Well engine make go now, so we leave. We be lucky to make back to Hainan without sinking.
American CO: I'll be lucky to make it back to Honolulu without having a heart attack. You took ten years off my life, popping out of nowhere like that! I honestly had no idea there was anybody else in the area.
Chinese CO: Sorry! We not know you here, really. You know Chinaman navigation equipment! No good! We go in straight line until bump into something!
American CO: Sorry to hear that. I hope you stay clear of us, we run into things all the time, since I dropped my sextant.
Chinese CO: Me too, since lousy Chinese boat leak on my chronometer! I go now! Bye!
American CO: Bye!
[Chinese sub submerges]
American CO (under breath): Asshole.
Chinese CO (under breath): Asshole.
Not just educated there... (Score:5, Interesting)
Right... (Score:3, Funny)
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Obligatory (Score:4, Funny)
DAMN YOU! (Score:5, Funny)
I propose that stories with claims THAT ridiculous this should have title and summary hidden with a warning so that readers eating or drinking can be prepared! I mean really...think how many geeks you might endager with a headline of "Openly Gay Republican Elected to Office"
Hate to spoil the punchline... (Score:3, Informative)
The Scorpion and The Frog (Score:3, Interesting)
I'm a Network Systems Analyst, but not in a Information Security role. Still, I felt it prudent to ask recently; "so, how are we hardening the systems going into China?" only to be met with the deer in the headlights look. I pointed out the inception of this story and then went on to describe how people could buy in iPhone 1.0 in China last year...30-60 days before last June's U.S. launch. And the fact that virtually ANY software you wanted was available, for pennies, in China. Hacked, cracked, and pre-loaded with malware galore in many cases, to be sure, but available nonetheless.
I didn't get the sense my comments got anyone in power even a little concerned. Luckily, I can retire in Fall 2009. I'll get to read about this upcoming disaster in the easy chair with a cup of joe. I may even think it funny since I won't have to do any mitigation of the virtually guaranteed compromise(s) that will occur.
Underestimating the potential threats in this part of the world is painfully stupid. Which explains the idiot who left an unsecured laptop unattended in a foreign country that isn't exactly an ally, economic or otherwise. There are several firms in that part of the world that offer services to Fortune firms doing business in Asia BECAUSE of the increased risks.
Disingenious? Naw...this is an outright lie, plain and simple.
Sun Tzu (Score:5, Interesting)
The art of war, Sun Tzu (6th. cent. B.C.), I.18 and 1.19
I'm skeptical (Score:4, Funny)
Damn you, falling U.S. dollar!
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Do they have a computer?
*check*
Do they have access to the Internet?
*check*
There. I've systematically determined that they're sophisticated enough.
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Are the target systems largely running stock versions of Windows?
*check*
------
For those that consider this Microsoft bashing substitute the following:
Are the target systems running large, complex, "user friendly" operating systems with more permutations of options than you can shake a stick at and lots of known vulnerabilities that can only be fixed by downloading updates from a commercial source who is picky about who is allowed to download those updates?
*check*
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Hah, I just saw some unique pictures on television. In the vicinity of the last earthquakes, people lost their kids in school. A Belgian reporter was with some parents, and those people are mad at the Chinese government, and there are accusations of corruption. A local official and a policeman tried to remove those people from around the school, got scolded by their citizens and left with their tails between their legs.
They ough to hire Tariq Aziz! (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Beowulf Cluster (Score:5, Funny)