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Security The Internet Technology

The Emergency Internet Bunkers 96

Barence writes "Should the Doomsday Clock ever strike midnight, we may well discover, finally, whether or not the internet really could survive a nuclear conflict. If it could, then a handful of datacenters dotted around the world would likely be all that remains of the multi-billion-dollar hosting industry. These secretive, high-security sites, tunneled out of mountains or housed behind the blast-proof doors of one-time NATO bunkers, are home to the planet's most secure hosting providers. This article profiles the emergency internet bunkers."
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The Emergency Internet Bunkers

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  • by mfh ( 56 )

    We should ship humanity's data to Mars for safe-keeping and just in case Mars was ever destroyed, we could backup in a randomly attuned dimension.

    • by mevets ( 322601 )

      Yes, but only in the sense of "a ship on the beach is a lighthouse to the sea."
      -----
      Q: So the problem is fat cats infatuated with expensive, unnecessary products?
      A: Exactly. Only now it's cropping up in Asia, too.

    • Just broadcast your data, suitably encrypted and duplicated, into space in one direction [not towards any of the planets or solar systems in our area].

      Then, if you REALLY REALLY want that data, you just need to invent and FTL drive, then travel to a point just in front of that data beam and retrieve your data.

      • You just need to invent and FTL drive, then travel to a point just in front of that data beam and retrieve your data.

        Brilliant!

      • by rdebath ( 884132 )

        Naa, "Delay line memory" is far too open to interference.

        I would suggest using Iron crystals; a small one would be a thousand miles across. They take a little while to manufacture but once they've cooled off they make a very stable storage medium. Just be sure to remove the outer layers of slag, especially any organic residue that may be infecting it.

        One of these will give you a few zettabytes of storage. BTW: You can put a lot more in if you reduce the ECC requirements but we're talking long term stor

        • You could embed or suspend these crystals on a vast platter design, and then just mark any that had organic contaminants as bad sectors in your organising system and ignore them.

    • As long as Blizzard keeps at least one WoW server in there, I'll be happy.

      That way while the zombies are feasting on the rest of humanities' brains, I can finally level up some toons.

    • Right over there near the emergency Triple Play packages and emergency transfer caps.

      --oh, that thing in front? That's the emergency packet shaper that EmergencyAdServer(TM) gave us.

    • by azalin ( 67640 )
      Well at least that should free up some IP addresses.
  • Uh, what? (Score:5, Informative)

    by ChinggisK ( 1133009 ) on Saturday March 12, 2011 @01:05PM (#35464624)
    FTA:

    In 1949, the Soviets tested their first atomic bomb, and they pushed the clock to 23:57. A year later, the US did the same – so the clock ticked on to 23:58.

    Uh, I thought the US tested their first atomic bomb in 1945? [wikipedia.org]

    • I was just going to post the same. I'm not going to bother to continue reading any article that can't get such a forehead-whappingly obvious "everybody knows" fact straight.
    • Re:Uh, what? (Score:4, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 12, 2011 @01:13PM (#35464698)

      A simple wikipedia lookup of the doomsday clock:

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doomsday_Clock

      shows how inaccurate that statement is. It wasn't a year later. It was 4 years later. And it wasn't the US testing an atomic bomb, it was the US and the Soviets testing thermonuclear devices.

      When an article begins with such obvious errors I have little inclination to continue reading.

    • FTA:

      In 1949, the Soviets tested their first atomic bomb, and they pushed the clock to 23:57. A year later, the US did the same – so the clock ticked on to 23:58.

      Uh, I thought the US tested their first atomic bomb in 1945? [wikipedia.org]

      When you RTFA, try READING it: "Since 1947, the Bulletin of Atomic Scientists has used the face of this fictional clock to plot our race towards destruction. In 1949, the Soviets tested their first atomic bomb, and they pushed the clock to 23:57. Four years later, the US and Soviets both tested thermonuclear weapons and so the clock ticked on to 23:58." Hint: the keyword is "thermonuclear", *NOT* "atomic".

  • they'll link them together with AX.25 [wikipedia.org] or packet radio [wikipedia.org], at 300 bps.
  • To protect us from the government and the entertainment industry?

  • This service will require an accurate measure of time, I think they should each have one of these.

    http://longnow.org/clock/ [longnow.org]

    I didn't read the article, but more than three nodes would suffice, along with other measurements of time.

  • Isn't this bad? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by peragrin ( 659227 ) on Saturday March 12, 2011 @01:16PM (#35464714)

    if the data centers are in secured bunkers, then skynet will have safe havens to hide in when it launches the judgement day.

    We should post the locations of these bunkers so we can make sure they are sabotaged so Skynet won't have any place to hide.

  • by mickwd ( 196449 ) on Saturday March 12, 2011 @01:19PM (#35464730)

    The reason places like this are now used for data centres is probably because they were originally built to survive the force of a fission bomb, but not a hydrogen bomb.

    Thus making them not safe as "nuclear" shelters. Which is probably why they were sold off in the first place. The fact that there isn't really all that much they are suitable for, except for something like a data centre, which can then be *marketed* as being "nuclear-war-proof".

    • I think a lot of these places are quite safe from being in the general vicinity of a nuclear attack, they're just not safe if targeted directly with a high-yield hydrogen bomb, a "city killer" if you will. So the militaries and governments of the world aren't interested in these facilities for their original purposes (command and control and such things) since they are likely to be directly targeted in the event of a nuclear exchange. A private datacenter OTOH is unlikely to be directly targeted and can thu

      • I seem to remember in the last gulf war a lot of civilians were killed when they took shelter in an old command and control bunker that the Iraqi military had vacated because it was no longer considered safe.

        Unfortunately for the civilians taking shelter the bunker was still on a targeting list, either in error or just to be sure that it hadn't reverted to military use.

        I would think these bunkers are likely to remain on secondary targeting lists for the same reason, but then maybe just the fact that they ar

    • by khallow ( 566160 )

      The fact that there isn't really all that much they are suitable for, except for something like a data centre, which can then be *marketed* as being "nuclear-war-proof".

      And it would be, unless someone directly targets the data center with a nuke. And if they do, they just wasted a nuke.

  • by khallow ( 566160 ) on Saturday March 12, 2011 @01:22PM (#35464744)
    I see a lot of nonsensical doomsday posts out there. Even if we have the full blown thing with everyone cutting loose with all the nukes they have and a couple of bad years due to fallout and nuclear winter, there's still be a lot of survivors, including the very countries that were involved in the nuclear war. It makes sense to talk about data surviving such things, because humanity and some sort of society would survive.

    Second, one doesn't need to have a full blown nuclear war in order for this data to be valuable. Maybe a widespread computer worm wipes out a lot of companys' data and backups. Maybe someone EMPed North America. There are a number of scenarios far short of the end of humanity where most electronics could end up being useless or destroyed.
    • by Kjella ( 173770 )

      Maybe someone EMPed North America.

      Even a full nuclear strike wouldn't produce enough EMP to do that, it'd probably be easier to get an asteroid out of orbit and do a dino-killer than to produce a continent-wide EMP blast.

      • by khallow ( 566160 )

        Even a full nuclear strike wouldn't produce enough EMP to do that, it'd probably be easier to get an asteroid out of orbit and do a dino-killer than to produce a continent-wide EMP blast.

        A large nuke several hundred kilometers up would do the trick.

        • No it wouldn't the EMP of nuclear warheads isn't much greater than the blast area.

          • by khallow ( 566160 ) on Saturday March 12, 2011 @04:50PM (#35466204)

            No it wouldn't the EMP of nuclear warheads isn't much greater than the blast area.

            That is incorrect. The US conducted a large high altitude detonation, Starfish Prime [wikipedia.org] a 1.4 megaton blast which caused notable electrical problems 1500 km away in Hawaii.

            The relatively small magnitude of the Starfish Prime EMP in Hawaii (about 5600 volts/metre) and the relatively small amount of damage done (for example, only 1 to 3 percent of streetlights extinguished)[10] led some scientists to believe, in the early days of EMP research, that the problem might not be as significant as was later realized. Newer calculations[9] showed that if the Starfish Prime warhead had been detonated over the northern continental United States, the magnitude of the EMP would have been much larger (22 to 30 kilovolts/metre) because of the greater strength of the Earth's magnetic field over the United States, as well as the different orientation of the Earth's magnetic field at high latitudes. These new calculations, combined with the accelerating reliance on EMP-sensitive microelectronics, heightened awareness that the EMP threat could be a very significant problem.

  • by Anonymous Coward

    Sir Humphrey: There has to be somewhere to carry on government, even if everything else stops.
    Hacker: Why?
    Sir Humphrey: Well, government doesn't stop just because the whole country's been destroyed! I mean, annihilation’s bad enough without anarchy to make things even worse!
    Hacker: You mean you'd have a lot of rebellious cinders.

    When I feel the need to be motivated into activism, I just think of nuclear bunkers.

    • You just walked out of the room? That's all? I'm disappointed. I expected you to beat him up savagely, to snap his bones like dried wood, to slice open his face with a letter opener and gouge out his eyes with your thumbs, and then to urinate into the bloody, empty eyesockets. I hoped for a good tale of good ol' ultraviolence. How you cracked his zoobies, how the krovvy ploshed all around from the burst cables as you razrezzed him through the shiyah with your nozh. How you dunged on his litso. You owe me an
    • The bastards whose power-mongering has caused the attack will be the first to retreat to the safety they've reserved for themselves.

      I've long applied the same sort of logic to the question of where to put high-grade radioactive waste. The engineering problems of managing the waste can be managed, IF and ONLY IF the politicians have incentive to continue paying an appropriate amount of attention to the problem. The only way that could possibly work is if the high-level "dump" is sited under the Palace of Wes

  • If not how would one recreate the dns? Is it harder with dnssec?

  • by arcite ( 661011 ) on Saturday March 12, 2011 @01:24PM (#35464762)
    an entire decommissioned iron mine in an undisclosed location in northern Canada is devoted to MILF porn.
  • a nuke will take out the data lines / power and on site fuel will run out.

    earth quakes can crunch under ground data centers and cut under ground data lines as well braking on site power systems.

    The japan earthquake knocked out the on site back power at the nuke plant.

  • But is it lawyer proof?

    • But is it lawyer proof?

      No. Everyone knows the three species most likely to survive an all-out nuclear exchange are cockroaches, rats, and a few humans. Lawyers are covered by the first 2. You and I, on the other hand, get to draw for the short straw.

  • by Dynamoo ( 527749 ) on Saturday March 12, 2011 @01:35PM (#35464852) Homepage
    When Sysadmins Ruled the Earth [baens-universe.com].
  • The article mentions 1&1.

    It's a popular host, but that often means bad service.

    Anybody have any experience with those guys?

    • I use them for 2 websites, one personal and one business. Customer service over the email was good, but never had any reason to call them. So far I've been pleased, but I've had no problems to resolve.

  • So Skynet really was in the bunker all along.

  • If not, targeting information please? Let's make sure the enemy knows what to hit with the thermonukes. Most likely this is a now obsolete system still useful mostly as a distraction or a secondary source of recovery.
  • OK, The balloon goes up civilization gets bombed back to the iron age (you can't bomb mankind back to the stone age, for a start there is lots of nicely refined iron sitting round waiting to be used). How long could you expect a well protected and environmentally controlled datacenter to survive in a usable condition.
  • The computers in the datacenters may well survive. But the power necessary to run them and keep them cool, the technicians necessary to fix them, and the tubes necessary to provide external connectivity probably won't.

    And even if they all do, the distributed clients of those datacenters would all need that stuff too--hosting a web page doesn't do a lot of good if there is no one able to connect to it because they don't have the power to turn their own computer on.

    Nuclear hardening datacenters is pretty us

  • I remember some other news about companies using bunkers; the usual reason is not protection against explosions but prices. If a bunker is no longer used in its primary functions, there is little else you can do with it (would you put shops in? offices? housing?). So, someone gets some state that already has tight security, backup electricity and refrigeration and, not surprisingly, he tries to use it as a datacenter.

    If you have any doubt, look at the list of customer.... mainly hosting providers. If people

  • Ah, so whoever wins the war wins the internet.

  • .. is really an accidental collateral result of that the purpose of the original project that spawned little miracles like TCP/IP... a self rerouting network that would preserve communication between key military centers in the event of outages caused by a bombardment, conventional or nuclear. These emregency bunkers have very little to do with the commercial/public Internet of today.
  • Should the Doomsday Clock ever strike midnight, we may well discover, finally, whether or not the internet really could survive a nuclear conflict.

    I don't know about that but the internet has been awesome in surviving natural disasters. I'm in Japan and when the earthquake hit on Friday the phonelines where almost immediately locked up but thanks to mobile phone emails I was able to confirm the safety of friends near effected areas and thanks to the internet I was able to message my family in Australia. A

  • I don't want global nuclear war, I like society, but if war did happen, one of it's very few benefits would be a shrinking of government overloads, a chance to rid us of waste and corruption, government on a scale people could understand. The internet would only be a hindrance to that. Would only help the worst parts of the government we no longer need. (military, the oval office technocrats, wackos with a agenda to press.

    TFA says about the US site

    it has two wells and a large enough water-storage facility to keep running water for a fortnight in the unlikely event they should both run dry.

    lulz. First off, a fortnight is nothing if the w

  • What a comfort. In case of an extinction level event, we can be assured that the final act of the last human survivor will be to check Slashdot for updates.

    • What a comfort. In case of an extinction level event, we can be assured that the final act of the last human survivor will be to check Slashdot for updates.

      They could get the first and last post at the same time!

  • Those who do not remember the Goatse are destined to repeat it.

"What man has done, man can aspire to do." -- Jerry Pournelle, about space flight

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