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Software Bug Halts F-22 Flight
Posted by
kdawson
on Sun Feb 25, 2007 06:35 PM
from the dare-you-to-cross-this-line dept.
from the dare-you-to-cross-this-line dept.
mgh02114 writes "The new US stealth fighter, the F-22 Raptor, was deployed for the first time to Asia earlier this month. On Feb. 11, twelve Raptors flying from Hawaii to Japan were forced to turn back when a software glitch crashed all of the F-22s' on-board computers as they crossed the international date line. The delay in arrival in Japan was previously reported, with rumors of problems with the software. CNN television, however, this morning reported that every fighter completely lost all navigation and communications when they crossed the international date line. They reportedly had to turn around and follow their tankers by visual contact back to Hawaii. According to the CNN story, if they had not been with their tankers, or the weather had been bad, this would have been serious. CNN has not put up anything on their website yet." The Peoples Daily of China reported on Feb. 17 that two Raptors had landed on Okinawa.
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Software Bug Halts F-22 Flight
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The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
Real redundancy (Score:5, Interesting)
(http://memomo.net/)
Re:Real redundancy (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Real redundancy (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Real redundancy (Score:4, Interesting)
(http://www.sigsegv.cx/)
During the Serbian wars NATO was scared shitless off all weather radars and shot at them without any second thoughts even if they were in neighbouring non-combatant countries. Both incidents when missiles hit buildings near Sofia (70km+ outside the Yugoslavian border) were actually firings at the Sofia Airport Gematronic radar system (the same kind some NATO country use).
In addition to that Stealth works effectively only if your receiver is colocated with the transmitter. It is easily defeated by decoupling them. There is a host of technical problems in doing this, but nothing that cannot be solved with enough software analysis of the reflected signal. It is only a matter of time until all "rogue" countries possess the relevant signal processing tech to do that.
So as far as AAA is concerned Stealth is a technology which is dead on arrival.
Re:Real redundancy (Score:5, Funny)
(http://slashdot.org/)
Yes. I hate those guys.
Re:Real redundancy (Score:5, Interesting)
NASA do not fly the space shuttle during 31 Dec -> 1 Jan [newscientist.com] as
they are not confident of what would happen. Better just
to avoid the problem.
That was one of the pressures to getting the Dec 2k6 flight off the ground.
Re:Real redundancy (Score:5, Funny)
But they fly over the international date-line every 90 minutes or so with no problems
they are very confident (Score:5, Funny)
(http://www.arl.wustl.edu/~mgeorg | Last Journal: Saturday January 14 2006, @01:59PM)
NASA is extremely careful with its software.
They don't fly from Dec 31 to Jan 1 because they know exactly what would happen.
Re:Real redundancy (Score:5, Informative)
crash narrowly averted (Score:5, Funny)
(http://www.atomjax.com/)
I've heard of a software glitch causing a crash before, but this is ridiculous.
Re:I would not want to be him. (Score:5, Funny)
Welcome to defense contracting, you must be new here.
Don't worry (Score:5, Funny)
(http://www.realistic-dragon.co.uk/)
Re:Don't worry (Score:5, Interesting)
The 27th Fighter Squadron (8 F-22s) at Langley AFB, Virginia fought against 33 F-15Cs and didn't suffer a single loss. The F-15's again didn't even detect the F-22's until they were all locked and targeted.
Then some months later during Exercise Northern Edge F-22's reached a 144-to-zero kill-to-loss ratio against F-15s, F-16s and F/A-18s. Only 12 of the F-22's accounted for nearly 50% of all kills for the Exercise.
Winning Tactic (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Don't worry (Score:4, Insightful)
(http://www.justiceforchandra.com/)
It's because we care about killing innocent civilians, and they are indistinguishable from innocent civilians.
If we can't identify the enemy, it's a good sign we shouldn't be there.
rd
Re:Don't worry (Score:4, Insightful)
I dunno, the Americans seemed to quite like the idea of the AV-8A Harrier [wikipedia.org], a British creation.
Source code... (Score:5, Funny)
(http://dr-tools.sourceforge.net/ | Last Journal: Tuesday January 23 2007, @10:27AM)
UTC (Score:3, Insightful)
(http://excelcia.org/)
Oh, and while they're at it, standardize on metric too. Maybe we can save our interstellar probes at the same time we are saving our warplanes.
Re:UTC (Score:5, Informative)
(Last Journal: Saturday November 03, @10:54PM)
Reminds me of the Bismarck (Score:5, Interesting)
(Last Journal: Sunday September 02, @06:01PM)
Gotta know your limitations... (Score:5, Informative)
(http://members.shaw.ca/tsmit/index.html | Last Journal: Friday September 21, @08:24AM)
Some exaggeration in the story, I suspect (Score:5, Informative)
I think not (Score:5, Informative)
(http://www.keirstead.org/)
The flight control software thus most certainly *does* have to keep the plane "stable".
Design? Lack of foresight? (Score:5, Insightful)
Design problem? Why should navigation software require "local time"? They knew they were crossing the international dateline, so they must be linked to GPS timing systems... why not just use GPS' universal time? (Sure, you want local time eventually for your displays but that's a "view" calculation, not one intrinsic to the navigation software)
Bug tracking problem? Did the testers not think of testing about a time zone change? Did they assume the above that everything would be on a universal time and therefore didn't see the need for crossing time zones?
Why wasn't this a stock reusable code module in Lockheed Martin's labs?!?
(And for a media look at this issue, check out the anime Geneshaft or the movie The Pentagon Wars)
Were they running Windows? (Score:5, Funny)
Ironically (Score:5, Funny)
(http://harun.abd.assami.googlepages.com/ | Last Journal: Thursday November 25 2004, @12:07AM)
I got to thinking if we had any decent alternatives (at least in C++). And yes there are alternatives and all of them looked equally bad to me. Looks like the F22 guys might have had the same problem finding and using a robust fault tolerant time library.
Re:Ironically (Score:4, Informative)
AV Rule 25 (MISRA Rule 127)
The time handling functions of library shall not be used.
I got to thinking if we had any decent alternatives (at least in C++). And yes there are alternatives and all of them looked equally bad to me. Looks like the F22 guys might have had the same problem finding and using a robust fault tolerant time library.
Why would you need to use a library? The only format you're likely to need in such software is milliseconds offset from some suitable epoch. As long as your hardware can produce such a time value, you're fine.
Er what? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Er what? (Score:4, Insightful)
(Last Journal: Saturday August 18 2001, @11:04AM)
You can trust the what and the when; I wouldn't trust their how or why any further than I could spit.
(This isn't anti-CNN; this is anti-almost-everything news media. Journalists aren't required to learn squat about science or technology for their degree and it tends to show up in every last article they write with even a passing connection to science or technology. Any even cursory overview of stories on any technical subject you know about will reveal this. Remember that "multi-gear rocket" atrocity from a day or two ago?)
Most modern fighters are intrinsically unstable (Score:4, Informative)
ian
So... (Score:5, Funny)
Actual dialog message... (Score:5, Funny)
F16 Software had similar problems (Score:5, Interesting)
http://catless.ncl.ac.uk/Risks/3.44.html [ncl.ac.uk]
Microsoft? (Score:5, Funny)
(http://www.yvan256.net/)
READ: Get Ready For More (Score:5, Interesting)
I told them... (Score:5, Funny)
(http://www.valerieandevi.be/)
not the only problem I read... (Score:5, Interesting)
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/IB10Ak05
"Keys notes, however, that the electronic spectrum around Baghdad is polluted by the myriad jamming devices that coalition forces primarily employed to thwart remote detonations of the improvised explosive devices that have inflicted 70% of all US fatalities in that war."
"The potential problem was discovered when the first F-22s were operating near US Navy ships off the Atlantic coast. Navy radars overwhelmed the F-22's automated sensors. Even now, larger, multi-station, purpose-built electronic-intelligence-gathering airplanes encounter difficulties around the Iraqi capital because of the extreme density of jamming devices."
Carry backup. (Score:4, Funny)
Now we know why they won't sell these to Oz (Score:3, Funny