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VMware to Make Server Product Free (as in beer)

Posted by Zonk on Fri Feb 03, 2006 08:35 AM
from the i-do-enjoy-a-good-free-server-product dept.
yahyamf writes "CNET News.com is reporting that in the face of increasing competition in the OS virtualization market VMWare is going to give away its GSX server product for free, in the hope that customers who try it will eventually migrate to the more powerful ESX server. The company recently released a free VMWare Player which could only run but not create virtual machines. The company faces competition from rival products such as SWsoft's Virtuozzo, Mircrosoft's Virtual Server, as well as open source software like Xen"

Related Stories

[+] VMWare Inc. Releases Free Virtual Machine Runtime 318 comments
rfinnvik writes "VMWare Inc. has released a new free (as in beer) virtual machine runtime called VMware Player. According to VMWare, this free VM runtime makes it possible for anyone to run virtual machines created in their Workstation, GSX or ESX products. It also runs virtual machines created in Microsoft's virtualization products. The runtime is available for both Windows and Linux."
[+] Ask Slashdot: Which OS Makes the Best VMWare Host? 141 comments
astrojetsonjr asks: "A few days ago, Trillian_1138 asked about running Linux on a laptop. Yagu started a thread suggesting the use of VMWare to allow running multiple flavors of Linux and Windows at the same time. Lots of readers then posted their success stories using VMWare . My primary machine is an IBM laptop and I'm getting ready to move to using VMWare to allow me run Linux, Solaris and Windows at the same time. First, what is the OS/distro with which you have had the best success hosting VMWare? Finally, what host OS install and setup tips do suggest?"
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  • hey don't leave out qemu (Score:3, Informative)

    by jomas1 (696853) on Friday February 03 2006, @08:41AM (#14634200)
    (http://nyamenation.org/)
    If you are going to list software that will let you run an operating system from within another don't leave out qemu ahref=http://fabrice.bellard.free.fr/qemu/rel=url2 html-2228 [slashdot.org]http://fabrice.bellard.free.fr/qemu/>

    Qemu may not run as fast as vmware does now but it's here, it's free and you can change whatever you want about it. The same is not true for vmware
  • Mmm? (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 03 2006, @08:42AM (#14634202)
    So where can I find this free beer everyone keeps talking about?
    • Re:Mmm? by stevenharman (Score:1) Friday February 03 2006, @10:18AM
    • Re:Mmm? by tbumpus (Score:1) Friday February 03 2006, @10:31AM
    • Re:Mmm? by spitzak (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @11:15AM
    • Re:Mmm? by BrynM (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @04:26PM
    • Re:Mmm? by Seraphim_72 (Score:1) Friday February 03 2006, @01:49PM
    • Re:mod parent funny, not troll! by Merle Darling (Score:1) Saturday February 04 2006, @10:17AM
    • 2 replies beneath your current threshold.
  • Mircrosoft (Score:3, Insightful)

    by raffe (28595) * on Friday February 03 2006, @08:43AM (#14634206)
    (Last Journal: Thursday November 20 2003, @05:55AM)
    I bet this is more because og Mircrosoft than Xen. When Mircrosoft is moving into a field competitors usally shiver....
    • Re:Mircrosoft by Darth Daver (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @10:37AM
    • Re:Mircrosoft by homer_ca (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @02:11PM
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • Intel VT (Score:5, Interesting)

    by lisaparratt (752068) on Friday February 03 2006, @08:46AM (#14634222)
    I would have thought the most scary thing facing VMware is Intel Virtualisation Technology - it makes what was previously very hard fairly simple. It also doesn't require the guest OSes to be hacked, ala Xen.

    I suspect we can expect to see a huge swathe of hypervisors being released over the next few months, if only so x86 Mac users can run Windows apps!
    • Re:Intel VT (Score:5, Insightful)

      by rfinnvik (16122) * on Friday February 03 2006, @08:52AM (#14634252)
      VMWare's real "killer app" in my opinion is VirtualCenter/VMotion. The management tool is better than anything else I've seen for managing virtual infrastructure - and the ability to move live VMs between hardware nodes is just impressive :)
      [ Parent ]
      • Re:Intel VT by ThePhilips (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @09:23AM
        • Re:Intel VT by man_of_mr_e (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @05:26PM
          • Re:Intel VT by ThePhilips (Score:1) Monday February 06 2006, @11:13AM
      • Re:Intel VT (Score:4, Interesting)

        by jcnnghm (538570) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:37AM (#14634527)
        Xen can also move live VMs between hardware nodes (only non-responsive for tens of milliseconds). It's going to be a very powerful tool once all chips have virtualization capabilities.
        [ Parent ]
        • Re:Intel VT by myowntrueself (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @04:46PM
          • Re:Intel VT by jcnnghm (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @06:09PM
          • Re:Intel VT by snark42 (Score:1) Friday February 03 2006, @06:31PM
            • Re:Intel VT by myowntrueself (Score:2) Saturday February 04 2006, @01:14AM
              • Re:Intel VT by snark42 (Score:1) Monday February 06 2006, @09:36PM
      • Re:Intel VT by tres (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @12:05PM
      • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
    • Re:Intel VT by Slashcrap (Score:1) Friday February 03 2006, @08:55AM
      • Re:Intel VT by lisaparratt (Score:3) Friday February 03 2006, @09:16AM
        • Re:Intel VT by Znork (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @11:13AM
        • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
      • Re:Intel VT (Score:5, Informative)

        by TheRaven64 (641858) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:17AM (#14634388)
        (http://theravensnest.org/ | Last Journal: Sunday October 07, @07:05AM)
        There are two parts to virtualisation:
        1. CPU virtualisation.
        2. Peripheral virtualisation
        The first of these is practically impossible on x86. VMWare and VirtualPC (x86 edition) manage it using some really, really, ugly hacks that kill performance (and then some more hacks to boost performance). Xen works by ignoring the problem. An operating system on Xen must be ported to not use any of the x86 instructions that don't easily allow virtualisation.

        The second is not very hard conceptually. You just need to do some kind of multiplexing and then expose your devices as if they are a fairly general device of the category. While this is conceptually simple, it is practically a lot of work. Again, Xen dodges the problem here slightly be requiring that the domain 0 OS supports the hardware, and then providing generic virtualisation routines for various categories of device (consumer VMWare and VPC do the same - not sure about the server lines).

        VT / Vanderpool / whatever make the first of these much easier (about as easy as it's been on RISC machines for the past decade or so and on mainframes for the past three. Yay for x86). They do very little for the second part of the puzzle. On PowerPC or SPARC, it might be possible to implement OpenFirmware drivers for hardware that are virtualisation-aware (IBM's servers do something a bit like this). I don't know if EFI has this capability; if it does then things like VMWare might become obsolete.

        Oh, the final part of the puzzle is clustering. Xen and the server-grade VM systems provide clustering support which allows virtual machines to be transparently migrated between cluster nodes. This is quite useful, since you can run N VMs on M machines, and squeeze the low-activity ones onto a small number of nodes, then have then migrated to their own node when they are under high load.

        [ Parent ]
        • Re:Intel VT by cruelfood (Score:3) Friday February 03 2006, @11:45AM
          • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
      • Re:Intel VT by Glen Ponda (Score:1) Friday February 03 2006, @09:17AM
    • Re:Intel VT by kma (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @12:34PM
    • Re:Mac already runs Win by generic-man (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @09:40AM
      • Virtual PC by addie macgruer (Score:1) Friday February 03 2006, @10:00AM
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • Good Move! (Score:1)

    by greyspk (949248) on Friday February 03 2006, @08:48AM (#14634230)
    (http://solaris.reys.net/english)
    At last they started to realise that it's the support services and not the actual cost of a product which helps you grow. Now if they could only give VMWare Workstation for free, they would be able to successfully compete with the catching up competitors, especially the already open-sourced ones like Wine or Xen.
    • Re:Good Move! (Score:4, Interesting)

      by jaseuk (217780) on Friday February 03 2006, @08:51AM (#14634249)
      (http://slashdot.org/)
      GSX does all you need. So why if GSX is free would you need workstation?

      Jason.
      [ Parent ]
      • Re:Good Move! (Score:4, Interesting)

        by jruschme (76180) on Friday February 03 2006, @08:57AM (#14634280)
        (Last Journal: Monday August 18 2003, @12:25PM)
        Which leaves the even bigger question of where this all leaves Workstation?

        Player makes sense... small run-only environment, embeddable, etc.

        But if GSX goes free what would a pricy workstation offer?

        [ Parent ]
      • Re:Good Move! by greyspk (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @08:59AM
        • Re:Good Move! by Zathrus (Score:3) Friday February 03 2006, @09:11AM
        • Re:Good Move! by StDave (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @09:18AM
        • Re:Good Move! (Score:5, Interesting)

          by jaseuk (217780) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:30AM (#14634474)
          (http://slashdot.org/)
          Well the only major difference between GSX and workstation is that GSX allows you to control startup / shutdown of virtual machines so that they can start at windows boot, it also supports remote administration and I believe you can manage the machines through their other tools such as VirtualCentre. I don't believe there is any great difference in system requirements for GSX over Workstation.

          Ultimately GSX, Workstation and player are all essentially the same technology. ESX only differs by being a custom linux distribution making it very easy to install and a web interface to control operation and a few enterprise features such as VLANS and the VMotion addons. They've also moved some of the virtual machine I/O and handling into a kernel module rather than running in userland to gain some sort of performance advantage. Rather strangely ESX seems to be slow at supporting iSCSI. Of course there are also tools to limit bandwidth and control CPU usage on individual machines, whereas with GSX and Workstation it's a free for all.

          Personally after trialling VMWARE ESX and GSX I actually prefer GSX. The "grow on use" disk type available for GSX is certainly better for small single use servers, flexibility to grow and keeps image sizes down for backups. I also really miss the client CD-ROM and floppy support which again is absent from ESX. The control panel also seems quite flakey.

          Personally I feel that VMWARE have got the pricing structure wrong somehow. The only way to truely consolidate is to use big machines (20-30GB RAM) the problem here is that the cost of 4GB RAM modules is rather prohibitive, then add in some server redundancy and all the VMWARE licensing fees and it doesn't make sense any more. I'd actually prefer to pay a reasonable cost per active virtual machine, that way we can keep redundant hardware and move machines around as we see fit for performance or DR purposes.

          I'm quite keen for GSX to be free or cheap, it'll then make cost sense to consider a VMWare strategy.

          Jason.
          [ Parent ]
      • Re:Good Move! by g2racer (Score:1) Friday February 03 2006, @09:32AM
      • Re:Good Move! (Score:4, Informative)

        by jbarr (2233) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:42AM (#14634567)
        (http://jimstips.com/)
        jaseuk wrote:
        "GSX does all you need. So why if GSX is free would you need workstation?"

        According to the Data Sheets found here:

        http://www.vmware.com/pdf/gsx_specs.pdf [vmware.com]
        http://www.vmware.com/pdf/ws_specs.pdf [vmware.com]

        GSX requires a "server" host, while Workstation does not:

        GSX:
        Host Operating Systems
        Runs on Microsoft Windows 2000 Server and Advanced Server; Windows Server 2003, Web, Standard, Enterprise and x64 Editions, and Linux server host OSes

        Workstation:
        Host Operating Systems
        Windows 2000 Professional and Server, Windows XP (32- and 64-bit), Windows Server 2003 (32- and 64-bit)
        Popular 32-bit Linux distributions from Red Hat, SUSE, Ubuntu and Mandrake; select RHEL and SLES 64-bit

        -Jim Barr
        http://jimstips.com/ [jimstips.com]
        [ Parent ]
        • Re:Good Move! by jbarr (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @09:44AM
          • Re:Good Move! by andersbergh (Score:3) Friday February 03 2006, @09:59AM
          • Re:Good Move! by scottnix (Score:1) Friday February 03 2006, @10:42AM
      • Re:Good Move! (Score:4, Informative)

        by paradizelost (689394) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:44AM (#14634577)
        (http://www.paradizelost.net/)
        Multiple Snapshots. GSX Does not have them, workstation does. and let me tell you, It's damn nice.
        [ Parent ]
        • Re:Good Move! by koadic (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @09:57AM
      • Re:Good Move! by BestNicksRTaken (Score:1) Friday February 03 2006, @09:48AM
  • What about existing customers? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by tumutbound (549414) on Friday February 03 2006, @08:49AM (#14634237)
    I'd certainly be pissed off if I'd just paid $1400 for GSX only to be told this week it's free.
    I've been paying for regular updates to VMWorkstation over the years, does this mean I can stop and just use the free products?
    That said, it's still worth the money I've been paying.
  • Limitations? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Comatose51 (687974) on Friday February 03 2006, @08:49AM (#14634240)
    (http://www.evilcon.net/)
    This is not a troll comment but can it run on a cluster? Will it detect that it's running on a Linux cluster and refuse to run? Here's what I'm thinking, a bunch of older computers clustered using one of those Live CDs that make them part a cluster just by popping the CDs in. I believe the software, can't remember the name, also does single system image or something like that where the cluster appears as a single system to the applications. Then run VMWare on top and run any OS you want! In my scenario, I'll be running Windows because our software is written for Windows but takes forever to run. I've considered building a cluster but couldn't think of an easy way to make it run on Linux. I was going to try Xen but VMWare is super easy to use, if my experience using it on Windows carries over to Linux.

    Very exciting indeed.

  • Strange thing to say ... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by cablepokerface (718716) on Friday February 03 2006, @08:57AM (#14634282)
    in the hope that customers who try it will eventually migrate to the more powerful ESX server

    It's not only more powerful, it's fundamentally different. It's requires a different sort of administration. Also, the usage is different. gsx wil rarely be actively used in high uptime required production environments, esx will. esx also enables functionalities such als vmotion (if you have a san [wikipedia.org] that is) and will be used more often in blade server configs.

    I really wonder if people will view esx as an 'upgrade' to gsx.
  • To play devils advocate here, why isn't VMWare resorting to patents to muscle out the competition? Why compete when a government monopoly can take care of competition for you?

    Are all their patents pending?
    • Re:Why Not Use Patents? by fireboy1919 (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @09:33AM
    • Re:Why Not Use Patents? (Score:4, Funny)

      by Dr. Evil (3501) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:39AM (#14634541)

      VMWare is not in a good position to use patents to protect their IP.

      The reason being that they actually have a product. This means they can be countersued for things like using a drop down menu, displaying a rectangle on a screen, ingenious stuff like that.

      [ Parent ]
    • Re:Why Not Use Patents? by Monoman (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @12:28PM
  • Why no free VMware Workstation? (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Mark Gillespie (866733) on Friday February 03 2006, @08:59AM (#14634292)
    Seems that GSX Server does everything VMWare Workstation does, so why would anyone buy VMware Workstation, when GSX Server is free? Don't quite understand that bit...
  • Wait a second.... (Score:4, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 03 2006, @09:00AM (#14634302)
    Doesn't TFA say they are "expected" to make their product free?

    expected != will
  • If (big if) gsx server is made available royaltee free is it possible to create images that can be played back by the free vmplayer? Does it not make vmware professional (desktop) obsolete?

  • Sublime server names (Score:2, Funny)

    by digitaldc (879047) * on Friday February 03 2006, @09:01AM (#14634310)
    VMWare is going to give away its GSX server product for free, in the hope that customers who try it will eventually migrate to the more powerful ESX server...Intel Virtualization Technology--code-named Vanderpool and now emerging in server processors--accelerates some operations and makes it possible to run Windows on Xen without modifications to Windows that otherwise would be necessary.

    I'm interested how the Intel Virtualization Technology will run on the up and coming SEX server.
  • Speculation (Score:3, Funny)

    by Simon (S2) (600188) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:02AM (#14634313)
    This is all news.com.com.com.com speculation. In TFA they state: "VMware may gain two advantages from the move..." blablabla "VMware didn't immediately respond to requests for comment."
    So the title "VMware to Make Server Product Free (as in beer)" is misleading at best.
    • Re:Speculation by NetJunkie (Score:3) Friday February 03 2006, @09:20AM
      • Re:Speculation by Simon (S2) (Score:2) Friday February 03 2006, @09:28AM
  • Kinda Worries Me (Score:2)

    by timeOday (582209) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:02AM (#14634314)
    This sounds to me like VMWare is under a lot of pressure. I'd hate to see them go away, because we use VMWare Workstation for some pretty important stuff, and the license cost isn't that bad in the grand scheme of things anyways.
  • by McGruff (37593) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:09AM (#14634343)
    I was literally 5 days away from buying a license to host a number of customer servers. This is a great product and closed source or not, I highly recommend it. The $2000 I was going to spend on it can now go to expanding the RAID array a bit. Now, how many terabytes fit into 2U? ;-P

          GXS really feels more robust than my experimentation with Xen 2.x and UML. It is still far and away better than MS Virtual Server, at least for the tasks I am planning on using it for. Unfortuanately for EMC and VMWare;
    with Mircosoft to the left of you
    and Open Source on the right,
    Like Sun
    Boldly they rode and well,
    Into the jaws of Death,
    Into the mouth of Hell
    Rode the six hundred.

    Apologies all around....
  • by base3 (539820) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:11AM (#14634348)
    . . . of much commercial value for long, given that the model of computing is headed for a TCPA/Palladium/Remote attestation/Client assurance/DRM lockdown. Emulating "trusted" computing would defeat the whole purpose of the "content" and computing industries' march towards that model. That, and they'll buy laws making even attempting such emulation punishable by just short of death.
  • by jocknerd (29758) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:15AM (#14634375)
    I'm waiting for that.
  • by nurb432 (527695) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:17AM (#14634383)
    (http://slashdot.org/~nurb432/ | Last Journal: Friday August 27 2004, @03:24PM)
    I live and die by GSX, does this mean they will stop development of new versions, Leaving just Workstaion ( wont do the job for me ) and ESX ( too expensive to justify )?
    • 1 reply beneath your current threshold.
  • Related Stories? (Score:3, Funny)

    by gmf (810466) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:27AM (#14634447)
    What is it with this "Related Stories" thing? Is that new, or why did I never notice it before?

    And most importantly: Will it also list the dupes? :)
  • Not GSX (Score:2, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 03 2006, @09:28AM (#14634454)
    The free product will be called VMware Server, not GSX. I am not sure if they will continue with GSX as a separate product, but I was under the impression that they will. I had initially heard about this here [theregister.co.uk].
  • by soboroff (91667) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:32AM (#14634492)
    "The company recently released a free VMWare Player which could only run but not create virtual machines."

    Sure you can. Take a gander at http://www.hackaday.com/entry/1234000153064739/ [hackaday.com]

    What you don't get with VMware player is the nifty GUI to help you with the setup.
  • by EvilNight (11001) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:53AM (#14634655)
    We're moving some of our development and most of our testing into VMs for the flexibility. We gave Microsoft Virtual PC a spin, but compared to VMWare it's pretty lacking in features, so we ended up going with VMWare Workstation. The advanced networking features, broad platform support, and snapshotting capability are huge wins for us. We had been planning to use Microsoft's Virtual PC Server product for collaborative development efforts because we get licenses with our MSDN subscriptions, whereas GSX was really damn pricey. Now, thanks to this rather canny offer of free GSX server, we won't even need to do that. This is most excellent.
  • vm builder (Score:1, Informative)

    by switchfutguy (880698) on Friday February 03 2006, @10:00AM (#14634711)
    who needs the full version if you have the player? The vmbuilder [consolevision.com] works great for me. all you need is an iso in the same directory as the vmx file. open notepad copy your code in save it as ".vmx" and you are good to go.
  • all thigns virtual (Score:1)

    by augur_seer (812090) on Friday February 03 2006, @10:18AM (#14634844)
    this is kool, good to see everyone wants to release something free, jsut keep the extra fancy stuff locked up and you can get "some" buissniess.
  • Going to .... (Score:1, Offtopic)

    by DrSkwid (118965) on Friday February 03 2006, @10:47AM (#14635070)
    (http://www.milksucks.com/ | Last Journal: Monday September 15 2003, @12:30PM)
    I'm going to the moon.
  • Confused... (Score:2)

    by afabbro (33948) on Friday February 03 2006, @10:54AM (#14635148)
    So would the Workstation also be free? My mental picture of the VMWare products was:
    • Workstation - can only administer it locally, limit on size of box, no VMotion, etc.
    • GSX - can administer it remotely, limit on size of box, no VMotion, etc.
    • ESX - everything
  • by schmidt4brains (890044) on Friday February 03 2006, @11:55AM (#14635659)
    I'm keen to find out if there are any x86 VM solutions for the new Intel-based Macs. Microsoft has made no comment about Virtual PC for Mac (which you would think might be the easier than emulating an x86 on a PowerPC). I think VMWare has always focuses on x86 Linux and Windows. So is there anything out there for the new Intel Macs?
  • evaporating market (Score:2)

    by idlake (850372) on Friday February 03 2006, @12:37PM (#14636005)
    VMware's market is evaporating. Their value was virtualization of a difficult-to-virtualize architecture, the Pentium. Now that Pentium is getting hardware virtualization, virtualization is simple and it will just become a standard part of Linux, Windows, and OS X.
  • What do you think EMC's role is in this? They could easily afford to give the product away, and sell services. VMWare isn't going anywhere; on the contrary, this could be decision from the higher ups at EMC to start gathering and holding on to market share, much like EMC has been doing with their storage for the last 2 or so years...what ever it takes, I am sure they will do it.

  • by mnmn (145599) on Friday February 03 2006, @02:39PM (#14637015)
    (http://ghazan.hazara.org/)
    VMware is not really competing with those other technologies. Its only looking at its impending doom at the hands of hypervisor technologies. Think about it, will you really need vmware when you have hypervisor... no vmware tools install, no slow machines, no lack of peripherals, full speed (almost)? For that reason alone I think I'll buy the first athlon64 with pacifica later this year. Hope they release a 754-pin version too.
  • by 101deletions (951854) on Friday February 03 2006, @05:42PM (#14638474)
    Can I set this up so that I have, say a win98 session running under XP, using a different usb keyboard and mouse and monitor, so that 2 people can use the same computer? That'd be cool.
  • by Shanep (68243) on Friday February 03 2006, @09:07PM (#14639595)
    (http://slashdot.org/)
    AMD's rival technology, code-named Pacifica

    I thought Pacifica was a complimentary technology for virtualization like VMware?
  • Re:Great! But.. (Score:1)

    by Demerol (306753) on Friday February 03 2006, @11:57AM (#14635682)
    (http://www.meatspin.com/)
    Products like netscape die because they suck.
    [ Parent ]
  • Re:WTF (Score:1)

    by rmpotter (177221) on Friday February 03 2006, @12:20PM (#14635870)
    (http://penopticon.com/)
    Exactly A/C. And someone always has to pay for the hardware, bandwidth, electricity, food, clothing, lodging, healthcare and education required for the production of "free" (and not free) software.
    [ Parent ]
  • Re:WTF (Score:2)

    by bill_kress (99356) on Friday February 03 2006, @12:31PM (#14635954)
    Free speech--concepts can be taken from person to person, reworked and made your own. Once you have heard something, you can repeat it a million times to a million different people with whatever subtle difference you choose to add, or keep it up to date with new concepts.

    Free Beer--You pretty much just rent beer anyway. They can stop serving it at any time and you are screwed (espically if you have become addicted). If it doesn't meet your needs in some small way, you're screwed.

    Free Beer is probably not a good foundation for your business, they are only giving it to you to get you to buy better beer anyway, but it's certianly much better than paying if you're broke.

    If you're flush--you might as well pay for it (tip) anyway to get the (bartenders) support.
    [ Parent ]
  • Re:WTF (Score:5, Informative)

    by civilizedINTENSITY (45686) on Friday February 03 2006, @03:09PM (#14637261)
    What the fuck does "free as in beer" mean?

    It used to be that on election day the political machines would send men out to all the bars to buy everyone beer to toast their candidate. The idea was that the free beer would lead them to vote for the guy. Since there is an implied obligation to vote their way, the beer wasn't really free. This is then contrasted (in the "free as in beer or free as in speech") to freedom of speech, which is obviously a different sort of "free". Likewise, "Live Free or Die" doesn't imply life without cost, but rather the cost of living free.
    [ Parent ]
    • Re:WTF by CounterZer0 (Score:2) Saturday February 04 2006, @01:40AM
  • 10 replies beneath your current threshold.