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Ask Slashdot: Are Virtual Or In-Person Developer Conferences 'Better'? 92

Posted by EditorDavid from the comparing-conferences dept.
Long-time Slashdot reader theodp writes: Microsoft Build kicks off online Tuesday as a free virtual event after plans for an in-person Seattle conference with a $2,395 entry fee and 6,000 or so attendees were shelved due to the coronavirus outbreak. It is just one of many large in-person developer conferences that were canceled in response to the pandemic.

While the deep-pocketed sponsors of Microsoft Build (virtual for 2020), Facebook F8 (canceled for 2020), Google I/O (canceled for 2020), and Apple WWDC (virtual for 2020) won't miss the loss of conference revenue, one wonders what the effect may be on nonprofit-run conferences like the Grace Hopper Celebration. GHC is also going virtual in 2020 (details to be determined) after hosting nearly 25,000 in-person attendees last year — registration fees were $1150 (general), $600 (academic), $450 (students)...

They may be cheaper, more accessible, and have a lower carbon footprint than face-to-face conferences, but are virtual conferences "better" than meeting in person?
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Ask Slashdot: Are Virtual Or In-Person Developer Conferences 'Better'? More

Ask Slashdot: Are Virtual Or In-Person Developer Conferences 'Better'?

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    • The answer is mixed (Score:4, Insightful)

      by goombah99 ( 560566 ) on Sunday May 17, 2020 @08:08PM (#60071802)

      I think the presentations can sometimes be better though not entirely. But the Poster sessions don't work on-line. And the collegialitiy of meeting and planning projects together or getting introductions isn't there at all.

      The presentations are better when the presenter is awful to mediocre. But they are worse when a stage presenter is skilled at working the stage and using body language to move your eye and attention where it needs to be. A mouse pointer does not do that.

      Also you can't nudge the guy i the seat next to you and ask a quesiton about the presentation you don't understand well.

      • This is a good point. Stage charisma does wonders in person but doesn't have the same impact with online presentations. This was evident with RedHat Summit a few weeks back.

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by account_deleted ( 4530225 )
      Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • If you didn't get drunk with people you hadn't seen in a year (or you've just met) it wasn't a worthwhile conference.

      The amount of shit that gets done outside of any conference dwarfs the value of anything that happens during it. My introverted boss is always blown away by what I come home with. Connections, skills, competitor pricing, corporate espionage, excessive reimbursement requests, etc.

      • If you didn't get drunk with people you hadn't seen in a year (or you've just met) it wasn't a worthwhile conference.

        Yes 100% absolutely yes.

        The talks are about the least interesting part of the conference (most people suck at giving talks). The poster sessions are better. The ad-hoc hallway discussions (often discussing some of the presented work), bitching, networking and going out are all very important. And they're great for maintaining connections with people outside your job, which is how you get the

        • Well said.

          Itâ(TM)s the social interactions, discussions, and networking that make conferences worthwhile.

          And, if you learn something new, the better.

          When I attended the Borland Developer Conferences in the 1990â(TM)s and early 2000â(TM)s, it was, awesome. Meeting people and building friendships and working relationships that still exist today...priceless.

          You might acquire more technical skills viewing an online presentation. But, there is so much more value to be gained attending in person.

  • sounds a lot like a meeting to me! I don't do meetings.

    Just my 2 cents ;)

  • nonprofit-run conferences like the Grace Hopper Celebration. GHC is also going virtual in 2020 (details to be determined) after hosting nearly 25,000 in-person attendees last year — registration fees were $1150 (general), $600 (academic), $450 (students)...

    A non-profit conference charges $1150 in registration fees? What do they do with the money??

    • There is a significant cost going to the venue for the space. Other than that I have no idea.

    • Have you ever attempted to put on any large scale event?

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by jiriw ( 444695 )

      Don't mind the non-profit part. What's with those fees in general? If I'd like to attend Microsoft Build (yes, I'm an active .NET developer and have experience working on both ASP and GUI application projects) they ask me to fork over ~10% of my annual income in registration fees alone? No way I or my employer(s) can afford that!

    • Re:What (Score:4, Informative)

      by Vadim Makarov ( 529622 ) <makarov@vad1.com> on Sunday May 17, 2020 @09:34PM (#60071996) Homepage

      A non-profit conference charges $1150 in registration fees? What do they do with the money?

      Half (or more) of these is renting the venue and AV. A quarter to a third is invited speakers (who get free entry and all travel expenses covered, sometimes also a modest honorarium). Throw the remainder at coffee and minimal snacks in the breaks, and the salaries for administration staff who spend a man-year organising the event. An event done without sponsorship easily costs $200 per day per attendee.

      Ways to reduce the fees: attract industry exhibitors and sponsors (often cover 1/3 the cost of academic events), pay from your research grant, get the venue from your university or organisation for free, get the admin hours from your organisation for free. That only works for smaller events, up to 500 attendees. Any larger and you have to charge the actual costs.

      • 17779 eligible voters in a district, 17779 'vote' as one [vad1.com]. This is Russia.

        Based on my personal experience in Russia, this seems like something that could reasonably happen, even if the vote was fair.

        • Nope. Statistical impossibility (odds vanishingly small). The voting districts are territorial, mix of ordinary people, not a single factory or single business. The actual support for this party was in the ballpark of 55-60%.

          But, based on my personal experience in Russia, most people accept your argument. Actually, Putin voiced it in the media after the elections, using almost your words. So the vote-rigging persists.

          • Nope. Statistical impossibility (odds vanishingly small). The voting districts are territorial, mix of ordinary people, not a single factory or single business.

            Yeah, territorial. It's pretty weird how in Russia, different places, whole cities even, everyone has the same opinion. If you talk to someone from Yekaterinburg, you already have an idea what they think of Tzars, and if you talk to someone from St Petersburg, you can probably guess their opinion towards Moscow. And people in Novisibirsk have some kind of weird Putin worship going on.

            • You are probably trolling but I will bite. You know, in Russia the population is also statistically likely [livejournal.com] to cast their votes such that the percentage for the govt party in their district is a round decimal number, withe a zero or five in the least significant digit. Look at the dip just-before 50% and the peak at 50%, etc.

              Explanation for the thick: the local official gets an order to provide 50% votes for the govt party. He looks at the count and finds it somewhat short of the target. The count then gets

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by godrik ( 1287354 )

        Yeah, I do organize similar conferences. And the breakdown is about right.

        Also, in this case, the conference is not a non-profit. The organization that plans and is responsible for the conference is a non-profit. And that organization has expenses they need to pay for. In particular, they certainly fund the computing education of some minority woman. They fund programs. They do stuff.

    • Judging from past experience,
      the vast majority of the money goes to the speakers and the venue. Some to catering, security, etc.

      Both speakers and big conference places usually charge exorbitant prices.

      At that price point, I assume it is for several days, maybe including accomodation, or many speakers and few guests, or the venue owner loves a bit of usury.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Bert64 ( 520050 )

      Hiring and operating the venue is expensive...
      Paying travel costs of presenters is expensive...
      Many of the attendees won't have paid full price for their tickets.

      If attending was free or very cheap, lots of random people with no interest in the subject would show up which would significantly increase the costs and make it more difficult for the genuine attendees to see what they wanted.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by q_e_t ( 5104099 )
      I've organised conferences on a not-for-profit basis, so briefly they include:
      • Somewhere to hold it
      • Things for people to eat and drink
      • Paying for speakers to come and somewhere for them to stay other than the streets.
      • Programmes, etc.
      • Publicity
      • Websites
      • Admin staff for registration and other activities
      • Graphic design
      • Sometimes project management by people who professional project manage events
      • Equipment, e.g. screens
      • Signage
      • Compilation of proceedings
      • etc

    • Try organizing a conference some time. Venues and staff cost plenty.

  • God forbid the full time staff members of the special interest conferences actually have to work their day jobs.

  • There is no replacement (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Jarwulf ( 530523 ) on Sunday May 17, 2020 @07:56PM (#60071768)
    for in person interaction. People evolved to socialize with people face to face not through glass rectangles. Having said that the majority of business meetings are complete wastes of time.

    • Comment removed (Score:4, Interesting)

      by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Sunday May 17, 2020 @10:29PM (#60072126)
      Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by jdharm ( 1667825 )
      I am one who spends a great deal of energy attempting to avoid direct interaction with other carbon units. They're dumb, confusing, disgusting, selfish, and waste a tremendous amount of time on inanity.

      Despite this I still find that I get a great deal more benefit from in-person conferences and meetings than online community. Something about people interacting facilitates the flow of information that would otherwise not. New ideas, deeper understanding of application of ideas, giving and receiving of ass

  • Virtual confernces are much better (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Doke ( 23992 ) on Sunday May 17, 2020 @08:00PM (#60071774) Homepage

    You don't have to travel. So you don't have to deal with airport security.

    You don't have to stay in a hotel.

    You can hear the presenttation, not people around you talking through it, coughing, and sneezing.

    You can eat your own food, and stacks, possibly during the conferences.

    You don't have to smell your fellow nerds (and vice versa).

    • You don't have to worry about how the only 3 topics you care about are all scheduled for the same timeslot in different rooms while the rest of the day is a waste.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Misagon ( 1135 )

      I prefer it when presentations are available for download or streaming.
      You can watch long-winded presentations at 150% speed, or skip sections entirely.
      Some presenters are just not good at speaking or are just too unprepared to conduct the presentation at a good pace. Some rare people don't even sound like they're talking too fast even at 200%.
      (Just don't ever make someone know that this is how you watched his presentation ...)

    • Also easier to get distracted especially with family in the house at the same time. Having the option to go back and replay is useful.

    • and you don't have to worry as much about being accused of violating this month's new social taboo.
    • Lol, you go to attend the conferences and see the talks?

      I might go to maybe 2 events / talks for a multi day conference. The rest of the time I'm hanging with friends, enjoying the town, etc.

      Your hotel room is irrelevant. It's just a place to leave your luggage and laptop when you go out to have fun.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Bert64 ( 520050 )

        Some people like to have fun inside the hotel room too...

        • True, true. I'm not into hookers or one nighters but I did go home with someone I met at a conference. The bar pickup thing isn't my scene but I get that it works for others.

          This one check-in desk hotel girl in Vegas asks how many room keys. I say one. She asks insistently 2-3 more times before she hands over 1 key. I wasn't sure if I was expected to need a second key for random bar pickup or her. Either way, not my thing.

    • I guess you missed the main point of conferences: To grow your network, get new connections to people with something to offer or who you can offer something to.

      If you only mean educational ones, then yeah, just watch the videos. Unless of course you actually want to ask questions.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by ranton ( 36917 )

      You must not have kids. Or at least not young kids. The travel is the best part of the conferences I attend. I would hate for constant travel to keep me away from my family, but about two weeks a year is perfect. I get to enjoy eating out, sleeping in (yes sleeping until 7am is sleeping in now) and going out drinking with coworkers / partners / clients each night. I look forward to them every year.

      Early in my career I attended my first few conferences to learn in sessions, but soon understood that wasn't th

    • But according to the several of the people who work with me, you then miss the important parts. The airline and hotel points. They will do their best to try to force any sort of meeting to be face to face at the other location. The current travel restrictions are really hard on them. But the airlines and hotels have mostly all extended elite status for another year so they aren't completely despondent. When this is over, we'll see what happens when I point out all the stuff that got done while the travel wh

  • Conferences were rewards (Score:3)

    by Snotnose ( 212196 ) on Sunday May 17, 2020 @08:08PM (#60071806)
    Work hard, meet a hard deadline, and pick a conference to go to. Company picked up airfare, meals, hotel, and conference fees. I used to always stay a couple extra days to visit the area. Last one I went to was CTIA in New Orleans in '04 or so. The wife joined me for that one.

  • I've never participated in any but as an outsider looking in, the biggest benefit of conferences isn't the talks, its the people. There is no better event to go to where you can reasonably guarantee that the people that are there are also in the industry or very interested in it. I've had friends that have attended various different event types and sizes, and have gotten job offers or learned about opportunities at these events.

    The talks are nice but the networking is the true value of conferences.

    • The last years of my tech career, the conferences I went to were all about specialized research topics. The time at the bar in the evening with a couple of the other people, waving arms and laying out different directions work could go were much more valuable than the formal presentations.

  • It depends. (Score:3)

    by redback ( 15527 ) on Sunday May 17, 2020 @08:10PM (#60071810)

    For the core of the conference, you can watch all the sessions on a stream just fine.

    But thats not all that happens at conferences. They can be a chance to socialise and meet new people. Often there is tradeshow type areas where you can fondle companies new products.

    Its sometimes nice just to get a trip paid for by your employer.

    I hope that more conferences have online arrangements, so that people who can't make it for whatever reason can still experience the core of the conference. But the in-person stuff shouldn't be taken away forever.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Junta ( 36770 )

      I hope that more conferences have online arrangements, so that people who can't make it for whatever reason can still experience the core of the conference.

      So the interesting thing is that in my experience, in person is best, online is not as good but workable, but a mix is simply the worst. When an online participant (or worse, a presenter) is active, then it just feels so awkward, particularly when the online participant is completely oblivious to obvious in-person cues about when to pause or solicit questions. When you are an online participant and know people are in person, then you don't have a way to subtly indicate that you have something to say that an

    • Often there is tradeshow type areas where you can fondle companies new products.

      I agree, that RealDolls conference was stimulating to say the least.

  • In-person is better (Score:5, Insightful)

    by david.emery ( 127135 ) on Sunday May 17, 2020 @08:11PM (#60071816)

    You don't get to talk to people in the hallways or at the bar on virtual conferences.

    I met several of my best friends, as well as got recruited for most of my jobs, based on contacts I made in the hallways of conferences. Sometimes it was a 'friend of a friend' introduction, sometimes it was going up to talk to the speaker after a talk, sometimes it was just being in the same elevator or talking when getting a coffee.

    Virtual conferences do have some advantages for delivery of their technical content, which others have pointed out. But for me at least, the social benefits over the last 35 years -way outweighed- the technical content.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by OzPeter ( 195038 )

      You don't get to talk to people in the hallways or at the bar on virtual conferences.

      Exactly. With virtual conference you can't take advantage random occurrences from which you can benefit from.

      The same can also be said with face to face talking to people in a physical office with whom you'd never normally speak to remotely.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Bert64 ( 520050 )

      You can also get acquainted with people online you know...
      I met many of my contacts and got my first jobs through online forums like IRC.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by eddeye ( 85134 )

      The correct answer is: no [wikipedia.org].

      The long answer is it entirely depends. Better for what and for whom? For reaching a large audience with technical presentations? Absolutely. For networking and side events? Complete rubbish. For making dedicated people feel like part of an exclusive club? Definitely not. For making money for conference organizers? Perhaps (virtual doesn't have to mean free).

      You're asking what's better, milk or beer, without saying whether you want to celebrate with your friends or

  • MSbuilt is going to be the experient to your question, so we will see when it is over on how it went.
  • The primary purpose of conferences is to disseminate information and knowledge. They are only incidentally social. If I want to be social, I meet my friends at the pub. I don't go to work-related cons.

    • The primary purpose of conferences is to disseminate information and knowledge.

      No.

      They are only incidentally social.

      Not even slightly. That's probably 70% of the function.

      If I want to be social, I meet my friends at the pub.

      How many of your friends have you recruited?

  • If its an online conference ill just watch the YouTube video at my leisure. I'm certainly not going to pay for the experience of sitting at home watching a lecture that will be on YouTube in no time.
  • Movers and shakers make contacts and develop relationships. "Virtual" conferences are not conducive to this. Technology still has a long way to go to replace in-person interaction.

    • Re: (Score:3)

      by Bert64 ( 520050 )

      Depends on the personality and the subject matter...
      People can make contacts and develop relationships online too, what matters is the personalities and mindsets of those involved.

      Meeting someone online also gets rid of a lot of inherent bias...

      I've seen people discriminated against based on factors which have absolutely nothing to do with their knowledge or ability in the field at hand. And this discrimination is often indirect, for instance if someone doesn't want to appear racist they will think of other

  • Comment removed based on user account deletion

  • That's my experience, and I think it is the general experience.

    People are just nicer when they are perfectly clear that you are a real person, with real feelings, real eyes that may stare you down (for what you did), and a real fist that may punch you (back).

    And online, you are practically bound to have more misunderstandings, which lead to conflicts.

    The bigger the conference, the worse.

    It's also way easier to coordinate who talks, and to group by being physically closer to somebody, to only talk to a few,

    • Re: (Score:3)

      by Bert64 ( 520050 )

      People are just nicer when they are perfectly clear that you are a real person, with real feelings, real eyes that may stare you down (for what you did), and a real fist that may punch you (back).

      I think the last part of that sentence is the key point...
      And are they "nicer" or are they simply pretending to be. There are an awful lot of dishonest social interactions, where people make small talk with those they dislike. Online there is less reason to carry on the pretence, people can be more honest about their feelings and opinions without fear of repercussions.

      We've all done it, wether consciously or otherwise... We meet someone who we take a disliking to, but have to maintain a false air of polite

  • definitely virtual... because then you get "unexpected network problems" whenever someone starts to bring up spelling errors.

  • Depends on your goal (Score:3)

    by AuMatar ( 183847 ) on Sunday May 17, 2020 @10:22PM (#60072110)

    Are you going to listen to the talks? Then virtual is better- watch at your own pace, rewind to relisten, etc. Are you going for the networking? Then in person in better.

  • ...as a speaker (Score:4, Interesting)

    by aaarrrgggh ( 9205 ) on Sunday May 17, 2020 @10:53PM (#60072170)

    I speak at a conference or two every year, and the virtual conferences take a whole new level of preparation to pull off well. I would do one class for ~200 people, and another for ~30, and the presentation took me about an hour to update and put together for each. (I have been speaking on the subject for a long time, so have most of my material.)

    Just giving a physical presentation in a virtual setting is a mess. You don’t have meaningful cues from the audience to know when to speed things up or slow them down. You don’t get the context of actually knowing the people in the crowd and who to target questions to. Things look much more “produced” than a discussion.

    As for attendees, the conferences I do would have almost zero value without getting to know other people there; my 90-minute sessions could be covered in 5 minutes for an extremely information-dense format without some of the fluff. But, me introducing Joe to Matt might help shape both of their careers...

  • .. that you just cant reproduce over videoconferencing.  My aroma has a message, and my secret flatulence is it's punctuation.

  • Better? For whom? (Score:3)

    by misnohmer ( 1636461 ) on Monday May 18, 2020 @01:28AM (#60072522)

    The question is missing a key part, better for whom? Like with everything else, there are advantages and disadvantages to virtual conferences. Whether that is better for you or not, depends on who you are and what you're looking for from the conference.

    There is no universal "better".

  • For me, I look forward to seeing and meeting with other folks in my industry that I only see once per year, at a given conference.
  • Does the conference have CEC's if you attend? Is there "hands on training?". Is the Conference mostly a "sales pitch"?. Do you actually learn pertinent information if you attend? Seems like, some conference's are worth going too, some are worth going, just to go, some are not worth the time spent to attend, be it virtual or in person. As always with these type of questions, the answer is "It depends".
  • I would say for the most part no. For me 90% of the value of the conference is the networking with fellow nerds and vendors, making new connections to people with something to offer or with people that have the same software/hardware/whatever that I want/have or skills I am looking to acquire. Sure some of the speakers can be fun and informative, but I gain more valuable information from 15min bitching and conversing with salesmen and colleagues by the bar then I get from 3-4 hours of sessions. You just don

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