Follow Slashdot blog updates by subscribing to our blog RSS feed

 


Forgot your password?
Close
typodupeerror
×
Spam

ABC Ads Target Answering Machines? 247

Posted by CmdrTaco from the it-was-only-a-matter-of-time dept.
Nerftoe writes "ZDTV an article about automated phone calls to promote its Friday lineup of shows. The odd thing is, ABC doesn't want to talk to humans. They just want to leave their message on your answering machine. What if I real person answers the phone, you ask? That's right, the automated system simply hangs up." I'm not in one of the markets that is doing this, but I have a personal policy of boycotting any business that tele-solicits me. (course the only show on ABC I actually watch is Who's Line is it Anyway, but since Comedy Central airs the much funnier sans-drew English version several times a day anyway, I don't consider that a huge loss either).
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.

New Ads Target Answering Machines More

New Ads Target Answering Machines

Comments Filter:
  • Great! So in the small claims court, all I have to do is to hit play on the answering machine that I bring. Instead of my word against theirs, I have got a recording of them calling me twice!

    Yes $500 - easy money!

  • It's not like the answering machine can watch TV - why try and convince it to? That must be ABC's target audience, since humans have a tendency to do one of two things when they get an ad on their answering machine, either:

    A: fast forward through the message. Newer machines just let you skip with a single button push.

    B: Get so angry at this blatant waste of time and invasion of personal space that they actively avoid the ABC network, even if it means skipping Regis.

    This makes no sense at all. Anyone who'd be influenced positively by an answering machine ad is probably too stupid to own and operate a machine in the first place, and accordingly has a job that pays so bad they can't afford any of the crap that gets advertised on ABC to begin with.

    Hell, most systems only work when a human answers, they don't hang up. The only people who should be considering running answering machine ads for ABC are the other networks. If NBC ran ads for ABC that way, they'd be so pissed at ABC they might well skip their Regis fix.

    - -Josh Turiel

  • I've been using this technique for years now - nobody on the line when I pick up, hang up. Why don't more people do this? Or why don't people learn that it's OK to interrupt a telemarketer's spiel with a kind "thank you, not interested" then hang up? Or just hang up when you feel like it? I think we need to offer Senior Citizens "telephone rudeness" classes to counteract the years of polite telephone etiqutte they have been brought up with that makes them so susceptible to these telemarketers!

    The only problem I've had with the no-answer technique is with people calling from overseas (well, people I want to talk to). Sometimes there is a slight delay at the beginning of the connection, but you can usually tell because there is a bit more line noise than from a telemarketer.

    Now that I think about it, even more annoying than those delayed telemarketers are the calls from machines that actaully tell you "please hold for an important message". Jeez, ok, you called me and you expect me to wait on hold as soon as I pick up? Right.

    -------
  • The answering machine is the big city where I live..

    Haha.. I make myself laugh.. Try this:
    The answering machine is big in the city where I live..

    wishus
    ---

  • Right, but it does leave messages.


  • to any person with whom the caller has an established business relationship at the time the call is made


    Couldn't ABC make the argument that the population of the USA has an established business relationship with them based simply on the fact that everyone has watched ABC at some point? They make money by selling our eyeballs, so if we give them our eyes to sell, that sounds like a business relationship to me!

  • After the first five seconds, I hang up, trusting that if it's someone I want to talk to, they'll call back.

    If you pick up the phone and hear "Please hold" you are advised to hang up as it is either telemarketing or someone to whom you owe money.

  • Coincidence that this topic came up today. I just purchased a service called "Privacy Director" from Bellsouth earlier today because these damn "Out of Area" calls keep calling me at home every freakin' hour from 9am to 6pm. I sleep until 11am every morning, and it seems like I am always getting woke up just to get a dead connection (they hang up on me because they don't have anyone to talk to me). Then they call again an hour later. I can't take this $#!+ anymore... I would just love to go completely postal on these @$$holes... No jury would convict me... mu hu hah hahahAhaHahAHHDH83DH*A

    *ahem*

    Anyway, it's really getting out of hand and we need to do some legislation to make these calls much more scarce.

  • Linux would be a great solution, but the reason I got this caller ID box instead of the rest was that it wsa the cheapest. (It also didn't have those anoying red LED's that blink each time you get a call, man, those things really get anoying. It had the largest LCD display also. It wasn't small, but not to big. I'll post the name of it tomorrow. :-)

    --Brandon
  • Many people in this discussion have been talking about telemarketers hanging up on them Now, IANAL, so I won't get into the legality of hanging up, but I can shed some light the software that many telemarketers use. A predictive dialer works like this:
    List of number is input/imported.
    Dialer dials each number, really really fast.
    If there is an answer, the dialer connects the call to one of the telemarketers. This is why, often there is a one or two second delay from when you say hello, and when the telemarketer starts in.
    If the dialer get a connection and there isn't a telemarketer ready to take the call, i.e. they are all on the phone, the dialer hangs up and will try the call again later.
    Annoying, but the good predictive dialers can call tens of thousands of numbers an hour. Somehow the dialers is hooked straight into the PBX and can dial the numbers at amazing rates. My $.02 worth.
  • Before you call the number on yer Caller ID display and start venting, consider this:

    Where I work there are maybe, I dunno, a thousand people in the building. When someone, anyone, picked up the phone on their desk and dialed an outside number, the number that showed up on the target's caller ID was the number to the receptionist. Who had to handle a good number of irate calls - "WHY DID YOU CALL ME?!?" - from people who simply wouldn't listen to the facts that it could have been anyone in the building.

    As it turns out, we just told the phone co to block ID to save the trouble. Too bad - because I'd love to block anonymous calls with my nifty little Radio Shack Caller ID F-You Box, but I can't afford to miss a call from The Boss.

    The lesson: The number you call back may not be the number that placed the call.

    There's always time for politeness!
    - Politenessman
  • US West has a solution for these and pretty much any solicitation calls. They call it "No Solicitation." Basically, you sign up for the service and when someone calls you, they get a soothing female voice telling you that your number does not accept solicitations and to put it on their do-not-call lists. Then they get a choice of pushing 1 or staying on the line and my phone rings. You can add numbers to a list that don't get the message, so your friends and family don't have to type 1 every time they call you. Since getting this service about a month ago, I've gotten zero phone solicitations. The only down side is that I have to pay money to be left alone, which I find kind of repugnant.

    No, I don't work for US West. I actually don't particularly like them.

  • Tytso dun said:

    In some states, it's illegal for telemarketers to simply drop the line after someone picks up. After all, it can be quite threatening for someone's phone to ring and then to suddenly drop the connection. For all you know, it might be someone checking to see if you're in before deciding to break into your house.....

    ObDisclaimer: IANAL. I do not even pretend to be a lawyer on the Internet. Your mileage may vary considerably.

    At least here in Kentucky, this type of sillybuggers would be illegal on at least two counts:

    possible telephone harassment (as in calling, and as soon as a live human picks up, disconnecting--this is different from "predictive dialing" which is the cause of most hangups with telemarketers (basically, nobody available to take the call when your phone number gets rang)

    A nifty provision in Kentucky's telemarketing law that prohibits nearly all recorded telemarketing announcements (you have to put a live human on the phone within ten seconds if the company doesn't have a prior business relationship with you, and in all cases you have to provide a number that may be called to be added to a do-not-call list).

    Conceivably, you could prolly even get them on federal telemarketing laws for providing no easy way to be added to a do-not-call list and in fact doing everything they can to avoid do-not-call requests (many courts would be likely to see the fact they hang up the snecking phone when a live human picks it up as a deliberate attempt to avoid following federal telemarketing regs, and may even see it as prima facie evidence of "willful" disregard--read: $1500 per offence if you sue in small claims court).

  • That's because there's a 2-3 second delay between the time you say "hello" and the operator actually comes on the line. If you don't have caller-id you can usually figure out a telemarketer by saying "hello", waiting about 1 second, say hello again, and if there's not an instant reponse, hang up.

    I did this before I got CallerID and it seemd to work. Everyone I know will usually acknowledge your "hello" within a second or two if they are a friend or relative. If not, then they will call back again and you can assume that it's someone you know. A telemarketer will usually not re-call again right away, and if they do then you definitely need to flame them...

  • >Call rejection is a scam. You pay to have anonymous calls blocked. OK, fine so far.
    >
    > The problem is that the phone company turns around and offers a service to businesses: blocked anonymous call rejection override. That way, the businesses that pay the fee can still get through.
    >
    > They need to start selling is a blocked anonymous call rejection override override.

    Why? So we can pay the phone company more to prevent marketers - whose harassment the phone companies already endorse by selling them ACR overriding services - from harassing us?

    Why? So that after we've paid (twice!) for protection from harassment, the phone company can then sell ACR-override-override-override ability to the goddamn telemarketers, putting us right back where we started?

    Fuck that. What we need is legislation such as the ballot initiative currently going around in California that would ban telemarketing altogether, thereby stopping the problem at its source.

    Call rejection isn't the scam. The real scam is the fact thet the phone company makes a small fortune selling weapons to the combatants on both sides of the ongoing privacy arms race.

  • Another favourite trick is:
    "I'm not trying to sell you anything but would you mind answering a few questions?"
    "Umm. OK." (Big Mistake)
    "If we were to offer you a whatever it is with a 30% discount, would you be interested?"
  • That would be excellent.

    Of course the biggest offenders here in SF, CA are the political campaigns, both Democrat and Republican. I remember getting LOTS of Bill Clinton, Dianne Feinstein, Willie Brown, et al. recorded messages last fall when the SF mayor's race was on. I'm sure the Repubs do the same thing in Orange County (say). If CA had this law, or similar federal law were in effect, the campaigns would face some very severe liability!

    sulli

  • "Half the scientists in the universe were working on jamming the Electronic Thumb's signals, and the other half were working on jamming the jamming signals..."


    --Phil (I, personally, have never before heard of "blocked anonymous call rejection override".)
  • Seriously, is this true? I skimmed the article at ZDTV and didn't see a link to any sort of confirmation. Now this story can be cited to both ZDTV and Slashdot and next who knows, but it's not any more true than if only ZDTV reported it. This sounds more like rumor than fact to me, mostly because I have difficulty believing that anything this supremely stupid would ever get off the ground, even in Dilbertesqe Corporate America. Does anyone have actual confirmation?

    ....

  • I don't know about the big Mich., but in Illinois it's illegal to target an ad to an answering machine. I still get them all the time, but it's illegal and should be reported to your Secretary of State's office if you have such a law.

    It's also amazing how often I'll get hangup phone calls from telemarketers. Grr...

  • Can you imagine what would happen if lots of companies started using this terrible waste of technology? Right now, I get at least twice as much spam as I do real email. What would happen if all of a sudden people were getting twice as many spam phone calls (hang-ups / answering machine messages) as they were real phone calls?

    I don't really see why ABC would be choosing such a low brow way of advertising, anyway. It feels as wrong as Apple advertising a new product through "forward this to everyone on your list" icq messages.

    --
  • In he State of Texas, it is illegal to make a phone call without the intention of talking. Just my 2cents.. AC

    Damn. Lots of modem users are about to be arrest in Texas.

    -d9
  • I thought it was illegal to do fully-automated (i.e. no option to speak to an acutal human) telemarketing calls. The Junkbusters summary of telemarketing law [junkbusters.com] seems to bear this out:
    The TCPA also prohibits artificial or prerecorded voice message calls to residences made without prior express consent, unless it is an emergency call or specifically exempted by the Commission.
    Presumably, these people found a loophole (or, I hope, incorrectly think that they've found a loophole, and are about to receive a clue-by-four message to the contrary).
    /.

  • tactics (Score:1)

    by latro ( 292 )

    Ok, if you really want to stick it to the poor schlub doing that job, then go ahead and waste his time - 'cause you are making him lose money. That's fair enough, since they did actually call you, but realize who, exactly, you are getting your revenge on! I feel sorry for those dudes, so I just hang up (sometimes I even politely say "no thank you" in the middle of their jabbering, but sometimes not)

    One guy I know just says hello then sets the phone down in front of the TV just to see how long they keep talking to nobody in particular.

    A former boss of mine who is Korean thought he would outsmart them by only speaking Korean - of course they immediately switched him to a Korean-speaking telemarketer! (I think it was one of those long-distance companies, so maybe that's not so much of a surprise).

    -------
  • If you can't talk to a real person then how do you get your name removed so you don't get any more solicitations? Doesn't this go against the FCC's 1995 Telemarketing Sales Rules?

  • waiting (Score:1)

    by latro ( 292 )

    And why is it again that you actually wait for them to switch you to a live person? Just hang up!

    -------
  • I think this is an excellent suggestion. Now how do we get the government to support this idea?

    Something else I've noticed is that you can with about 99% accuracy detect a telemarketing call by the delay of their inital response. When you answer the phone and say "Hello" it usually takes a second for them to respond. Next time you get a telemarketing call, take note of this... if the person on the other end doesn't initially respond as quick as a normal caller would, odds are good it's a telemarketer. And I have a one sound answer to those calls.... "click."

  • Forgot one (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Years ago, I witnessed my best friend tell an MCI drone that he didn't need to change his long distance service because he didn't have a phone. You could almost hear the wheels turning inside the telemarketer's head during the pause that insued. It was great!
  • I've been getting this stuff for a couple of weeks now. I've never gotten a message on my voice mail, but it does seem to be some automated thing calling me and hanging up.

    I can't stand this kind of crap. I live and work not too far from L.A., something like this on my answering machine would have me finding ABC here in town and giving them what for. It's bad enough when automated telemarketing systems call me and expect me to listen to a recording.

  • What idiot moderated the parent to this thread down as "off-topic"? If the fool had read the story, they would have seen that the last sentence read "(course the only show on ABC I actually watch is Who's Line is it Anyway, but since Comedy Central airs the much funnier sans-drew English version several times a day anyway, I don't consider that a huge loss either). "

    The parent thread discusses the English version. The parent thread discusses the ABC version. The main thrust of the story is about telemarketers, but the story also opens up other discussions too.

    So moderate me down too. Ignorant pigs!
  • You can get nice new digital answering machines with good clarity :)
  • Yet another possible abuse of DMCA.... I LIKE IT!!! Seriously, though, I am sure you can find a whole slew of laws to apply against this, and with caller id or call trace enabled, I'm sure you could make money off of lawsuits for a while until people wisened up.
  • This is no longer the case. According to my New York Times on the 22nd, "ABC has backed away from a controversial plan to use sitcom stars like Norm MacDonald to promote its fall lineup by leaving taped messages on the home answering machines of viewers." I'm sure there's a copy available on the online NY Times archive, for a fee. :P ABC was facing a tremendous backlash, and changed their minds about this being a good idea. There may still be references available at the New York Times [nytimes.com]. The funniest promotional idea for ABC, however, can be found in the bathroom [yahoo.com].
  • Hello, this is Homer Simpson, a.k.a. Happy Dude. The court has ordered me to call every person in town to apologize for my telemarketing scam. I'm sorry. If you can find it in your heart to forgive me, send one dollar to Sorry Dude, 742 Evergreen Terrace, Springfield. You have the power.

    -------

  • Was it a short, kinda roundish guy, covered in white fur and had large, floppy ears? He also has an affinity for using a switchblade.

    Yeah, I think this is the guy [sluggy.com].

  • Was illegal in California ten years ago (Score:3)

    by A nonymous Coward ( 7548 ) on Monday July 24, 2000 @12:13PM (#909079)
    I got a telemarketer in trouble for violating two rules:

    Must be a human who makes the call, and only switches to a recording when the recipient agrees to listen to it. This guy had a war dialer.

    Must disconnect when the recipient disconnects. This is to allow someone to hang up and call 911 if necessary. This idiot's machine kept the line tied up for several minutes.

    To make it short, I left my name and asked for a callback, then had a zillion reasons for being busy, until he finally gave me his number. Then a quick call to Pac Bell, who refused to do anything, and a call to the state PUC, who straightened them out.

    --

  • Getting Back at Telemarketers (Score:3)

    by slasher666 ( 79983 ) on Monday July 24, 2000 @12:17PM (#909081)
    I have only a mobile phone anymore, so I no
    longer get to do this, but, back in the day,
    when I'd get a telemarketer calling, I'd

    SIMPLY INITIATE PHONE SEX!!!

    Ask the telemarketer what they're wearing.
    Ask them to take it off very slowly...
    etc...

    Funny as hell!

  • Re:Is this even legal? (Score:3)

    by Tackhead ( 54550 ) on Monday July 24, 2000 @10:42AM (#909082)
    >And what about bans on computer calling? Or do they have a real human talk to the answering machine

    That's why they're hanging up when a human answers the phone!

    It's illegal to have a machine dial up and play a recorded spiel. It's easy to prove it if you live in a state that allows a single party to tape a phone call with or without the consent of the other party. A taped call with a spiel that drones on and on despite repeated queries of "Hello? Are you a human or a recording?" is pretty damning evidence that it's a robo-dialer.

    But it's much harder to prove that the message on your answering machine was generated by a machine. Telemarketers can, have, and will continue to, perjure themselves on the stand by saying "Yes, that message was left by a live human", thereby turning the burden of proof on the person charging them under the TCPA.

    Yet more reason why the entire industry should be outlawed.

  • Isn't this illegal in some states? (Score:5)

    by tytso ( 63275 ) on Monday July 24, 2000 @09:52AM (#909086) Homepage
    In some states, it's illegal for telemarketers to simply drop the line after someone picks up. After all, it can be quite threatening for someone's phone to ring and then to suddenly drop the connection. For all you know, it might be someone checking to see if you're in before deciding to break into your house.....
  • > [... description of ABC's urinal ad campaign snipped... ]

    I think you mean:

    ABC: Finding yet another use for the color yellow [yahoo.com].

  • Hmm.... (Score:2)

    by GoRK ( 10018 )
    And where do you think they got the list of all their viewer's phone numbers?

    You guessed it. Calling the "Who Wants to be a Millionaire" 1-800 number! Did you know that you can't block your phone number being relayed to a Toll-Free, 900, or 977 number?

    I bet they sell this list to their advertisers too.

    ~GoRK
  • Check the law [cornell.edu].

    It plainly states:
    (b) Restrictions on use of automated telephone equipment
    (1) Prohibitions
    It shall be unlawful for any person within the United States -
    (B) to initiate any telephone call to any residential
    telephone line using an artificial or prerecorded voice to
    deliver a message without the prior express consent of the
    called party, unless the call is initiated for emergency
    purposes or is exempted by rule or order by the Commission
    under paragraph (2)(B);
  • (loud music)

    HELLO?

    (Pause)

    HANG ON A SECOND...

    (Sound of stomping across the floor. Music stops. Sound of stomping across the floor.)

    Hello?

    (Pause)

    Oh... Well he's not here, and I'm just a machine, so you probably should leave a message. (BEEP)

  • Telemarketer: Hello, is Mr. Tosh there?
    Me: Yes he's here, what is this in relation to?
    Telemarketer: We'd like to sell him a...
    Me: Ok, I fetch him, just a minute please
    Me [leaves receiver off hook, and goes back doing whatever I was doing before]
    Me [20 minutes later, after a quick glance at my ISDN logs]: Gee, they are getting stupider day by day: this one stayed 13 minutes!

  • Re:Isn't this illegal in some states? (Score:3)

    by _Sprocket_ ( 42527 ) on Monday July 24, 2000 @10:03AM (#909101)
    I guess they'd better bring me in on charges.. I've been hanging up on solicitors for the past 3 years without saying a word...
    You call up solicitors? Wow. I get enough of them bothering me without initiating contact on my own.
  • I'm sure we'd all love the home phone number of the jag-off at ABC who dreamt this wonderful scheme up. Really, any high level executive's phone number will do. When's the last time someone like this got their telephone slashdotted?

  • OK, I know its a little off topic, but I felt like sharing. Here's the best response to telemarketers I've yet heard. Converstion goes like this:

    [Phone Rings] Me: Hello? Hello?

    [Telemarketer answers] TM: Blah blah buy product blah blah.

    Me: Yes, I'm very interested, but I'm quite busy. Hang on one sec, I'll be RIGHT back.

    I sit back down to dinner, phone off hook.

    Several minutes later, that noise that tells me to hang up the phone starts, so I get up and hang up the phone.

    The best part is, the most valuable thing they have is an interested customer, second is time. I make them waste time by pretending to be interested, until they decide I must not be... and eventually they hang up. Try it some time.

  • Lets slashdot those idiots. Option 1: Go find your local station at: http://abc.go.com/local_stations/ls_home.html Call them. If someone picks them hang-up. Repeat this until you get an answer machine and let that machine know how you really feel about this. Option 2: We all request a webpage from www.abc.com if a webserver answers, hang-up. Repeat 50 Gillizion times. DDOS as a form of justified civil disobedience. Heck, they are setting the precedent.
  • I'm sure with voice recognition etc we can whip something up-

    Computer: Hi I'm Eliza.
    Marketeer:
    C: Does it please you to believe that you're from XXXX and have a great offer for me?
    M: Yes!
    C: Hmmm....Interesting, could you explain a little bit better?"
    M:
    C: You seem quite sure!
    ..
    C: I'm actually quite boring, lets talk about you..

    And so on :).

    Link.

  • alan.cohen@abc.com already confirmed that they are *NOT* doing this.

    You see, prerecorded calls are *ILLEGAL*, in general, under the TCPA. The prospect of $500 minimum statutory damages *PER PERSON* probably stopped them.

    Anyway, this is old news, it went through the TCPA lists a few days ago, and it's already dead.
  • In the UK anyway we have a law that prohibits making calls "without intent to communicate" to stop people running wardialers searching for modems.

    Sounds like quite a similar situation to me.
  • They need to start selling is a blocked anonymous call rejection override override.

    I've got this already, essentially. I have a voice modem in my linux box, so I hacked up a perl script to make it my answering machine. Whenever callerid data comes up as Unknown or Private, the computer answers immediately (usually just after the first ring, sometimes before the phone itself actually rings). Works like a charm. Telemarketers never bug me now, and on the rare occasion that someone I know has callerid blocking, they can either leave a message or call back using *82.

  • And I've won $500 claims in courts against people using them. Right now I have to get around to getting a company called Independent Mortgage in Dana Point, CA, which uses one.

    I think you should get $1500 but I couldn't convince the smaill claims court commissioner, even though I had documentary evidence the other guy was perjuring himself.
  • I got the same thing in MA. However, the phone company gave me the address for the direct marketing association and send them a letter to quit calling me. Hasn't really worked much.

    Some areas where Bell Atlantic are offer anonymous call rejection, where callers that don't identify themselves via caller ID get a message saying that the recipient of the call is rejecting them. Of course, it's not available (yet) in my area...
  • I've found that people trying to sell phone long distance are a great source of amusement. Asked how many long distance calls I make, I tell them none, cause I don't have any friends. "Will you be my friend. PLEEEEEEEASSSEEEEEE. We can go to hockey games any everything. PLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEASSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSEE EEEEE."
  • This is completely legal. Collection agencies use autodialers, where a machine dials lots of numbers and when a person (or answering machine) picks up the phone, it transfers the line to them. I worked as a bill collector on an autodialer. it is a great way to make a whole lot of calls quickly.

    Mike
    --
    Mike Mangino
    Sr. Software Engineer, SubmitOrder.com
  • Hell, I think this is a good idea! They should make these types of telemarketing calls legal, and outlaw all other types. This way, when I get home from work, all I have to do is keep my finger hovered over the delete button to trash the telemarket calls. And when I'm home and physically pick up the phone, I'd be guarenteed that there's not going to be a sales pitch at the other end.

  • ...all the time in the Chicago area. It's getting to the point where nearly half of the phone calls we receive have `dead air' on the other end. Then, some time later, we get a call from a real telemarketer. The current theory is that the telemarketers have their computer call to see if anyone's at home, then queue up the call to one of their telemarketing drones who make the real call.

    OK, this isn't exactly what the main posting's about. But this is: I have received several messages on our Ameritech voice mail containing what sound like computer synthesized messages. Mostly regarding whether I want/need new cellular service (Hint to Motorola: NO TO BOTH QUESTIONS!) Since I cannot fast forward through voice mail on Ameritech's service, this really torques me off. If it keeps up I'll have to cancel my voice mail and go back to a tape machine. Wonder if I complain to Ameritech enough whether they'll do anything about the annoyance... Nah! What am I thinking?


    --

  • Here's an evil revenge plot... (Score:3)

    by Sick Boy ( 5293 ) on Monday July 24, 2000 @01:18PM (#909158) Homepage
    Just a theory, but playing data CD's through speakers can blow them out. Why not hook up your old walkman with a 100 Free Hours On AOL! cd to a big red button on your phone that turns off your receiver (to avoid damaging it), then starts to play the cd? Should fry the telescum's (usually non-cheap) equipment, yes?

    Ah, just a thought. At least until I get some schematics.
    --
  • At my house we have several caller ID's. I don't remember the make (if you want it, post and I'll get back tomorrow) that does the call rejection with hardware at my house. The caller ID box it's self picks up the phone and simply says "This person does not accept anounymous calls, please hangup and turn off....." You can also pick up the phone if you do want it. I just wait for 2 rings. If I hear 1 ring, it was anonymous and rejected. This takes care of a LOT of solicitation.

    My point is, don't pay the phone company to reject calls, pay an extra $1 or 2 and get it done on the caller ID box it's self. Then you don't have to worry about caller ID blocking override.

    --Brandon
  • "... and thus, the Infinite Improbablity Drive appeared out of thin air." (That's one of my all time favorite bits of logic.)
  • Even if the answering machine plan has been cancelled, people using urinals [yahoo.com] may soon hear wise-ass remarks from ABC star Norm MacDonald as they try to do their business. It's all part of ABC's new strategy: "ABC: As If 'Is That Your Final Answer?' Was Annoying Enough."

    BTW, other companies have used answering machines to send advertising. It's similar to "Important Memos!" about vacation packages in Florida coming through the fax machines of office buildings. The phone system where I now work was hit three months ago with telemarketers calling at 5:00 AM and leaving voice mail commercials. Funny thing was, the quality was so bad, you couldn't hear what they were saying over the staticky background music.
  • Check out the boilerplate [slab.org] I send when I get junk email. It cites the following material from US Code:
    US Code Title 47, Sec.227(b)(1)(C):

    "It shall be unlawful for any person within the United States to use any telephone facsimile machine, computer, or other device to send an unsolicited advertisement to a telephone facsimile machine"

    A "telephone facsimile machine" is defined in Sec.227(a)(2)(B) as:

    "equipment which has the capacity to transcribe text or images (or both) from an electronic signal received over a regular telephone line onto paper."

    Sounds close enough to me. Can we have this shot down before it gets out of control? IANAL of course, but I think we can defend against this...



  • Call Privacy (Score:3)

    by Malc ( 1751 ) on Monday July 24, 2000 @10:19AM (#909176)
    It was because of telemarketers that I got a call privacy package added to my phone service. Although I hate giving more money to the telco, it's preferable to dealing with those other wankers.

    For those who don't know about or have access to call privacy, it does the following: for all anonymous or blocked calls, the caller is intercepted and forced to say their name (or my name as some of my friends at the office would do!). When I pick up the phone I get to hear the message and either refuse it, answer it, or send it to voice mail. For my friends with cell phones, or co-workers, who don't show up on my caller ID display, I've told them a simple code to bypass the system so that they don't hang around.

  • Re:Isn't this illegal in some states? (Score:4)

    by WNight ( 23683 ) on Monday July 24, 2000 @11:17AM (#909188) Homepage
    There was a funny story of vigilantism in a community newspaper a while back (East Vancouver paper, dunno which one, 'bout a year ago.) where the manager at a telemarketing firm was kidnapped after work, driven out of town, dumped out and beaten senseless.

    Supposedly he was told while it was happening (he was blindfolded and tied) that it was because the office he managed kept call the person (the assailant) back and being rude when asked to not call in the future.

    They told him that if the office didn't shut down, they'd break his back the next time.

    Was a bit hunt for the guy, didn't hear that he'd ever been caught, or anything about the telemarketer.

    Can't say I feel a lot of sympathy... When I was just out a school I worked, for two days, as a telemarketer. The boss was dishonest, they sold magazines and no matter which ones you picked, they sent you (and billed for) the same ones. They instructed people to harrass people on cell phones to make them buy, because many people would pay just to get you off the phone, no being strong-willed enough to hang up.

    I quit that and never looked back... anyone making money in that business is a crook, plain and simple.
  • My room mate's answering machine message demands that, if the caller is a telemarketer, they remove my room mate's name from their call list and do not call back.

    A local hardware store sells a little button you can push when you get a call from a telemarketer. It plays a pre-recorded request to remove you from their call list, quotes the approproate legal passages at them, and disconnects.

  • Yeah, they'll protect you, for a fee, from other attorneys.

    Nice service, but when the Italian guys offer it, we call it a protection racket.
  • "... Advertisers who leave a message on this machine will be charged an access fee of $45. Leaving such a message indicates acceptance of these terms." This is best done with a single-tape answering machine with date, time, caller ID. Each time you get a message, take out the tape, seal it in a bag and write the name of the advertiser, and the date and time on the bag. It is now evidence. Keep it. If the ABC or any other advertiser gets into trouble with the FTC for this, you can turn it over to them. You can also use it yourself if you sue them for breach of contract. --- Or, you might like to try the following message: "Hello? ... (pause) ... No, there's nobody able to take your call at present, so please leave a message after the beep." This attempts to circumvent the answering-machine-detection technology. If the technology assumes that a pause on the other end means there's a human on the line, this will confound the technology. --- Another thing that may confound the technology is if it uses the quality of the signal as an indication of whether it is talking to a human or a machine. The signal quality of answering machine tapes is generally a lot worse than a live human on the line, so if you can somehow get a REALLY high-quality answering-machine message, you may flummox the technology enough to make it hang up. --- Wouldn't it be nice if you could firewall your phone? No caller ID? Reject the call. You may be able to do this at the exchange, but it could also make an interesting project for someone with knowledge of the phone system and time on their hands.
    --
  • One day I was watching Highlander and was interrupted by a telemarketer trying to sell me life insurance. I promptly told him I that, being immortal, I had no need to for life insurance. I then tried to sell him the secret of immortality. After a few minutes, he became very flustered and hung up. I laughed for about an hour.

    Most recently, MCI called trying to sell me long distance. I acted amazed at hearing another human voice, and revealed that I had been 'hiding in my Y2K bunker for the last 7 months!' My roommate even got in on it and began shouting in the background about 'cracking open the airlock'. It was a riot!

    Other ideas I have tried:

    1. If they are trying to sell you a newspaper or magazine, insist that you are psychic and do not need their product, then become disgusted by what they are thinking at that moment.

    2. Act like you are in the midst of hostage negotiations. Play the cop side of the conversation. "So if I agree to subscribe to that magazine, will you release some of the hostages?"

    3. In an agitated and paranoid voice, ask them how they got the number. Insist that they are lying and are really 'part of the conspiracy' or 'one of them'. There are endless possibilities with this one.

    There are also some really great things you can do with a prepared tape of sound effects.

    Have fun!

    Thad

  • Oh sure, like picking up the phone and hearing a busy signal isn't going to be weird. If that happened, I'd call the phone company and report something broken.

    'Just like an advertisment on TV', sure, except that TV shows are free, the phone and voice mail are payed for already.

    I'd support a complete ban on any unsolicited commercial calling, and a $500 fine or something hefty to back it up. With jail time for anyone found repeat offending.

  • It is illegal to make unsolicitated calls to a cell phone (US for sure, not sure about other countires) because I pay for the time. I don't answer my land line phone, as that is for the computer, and will soon be cancled when something better comes through. Turns out that with free long distance it is cheaper for me and my roommates to use a cell phone with 600-1000 (day vs weekend) mintues a month.

  • This is funny. (Score:3)

    by FPhlyer ( 14433 ) on Monday July 24, 2000 @10:12AM (#909199) Homepage
    The ABC Friday lineup simply SUCKS. They have nothing good (in the way of post-adolescent) programming on Friday nights. I guess they are hoping that someone is going to listen to their answering machine and somehow come away saying "...must ... watch ... Sabrina the Teenage Witch..." or "Gee, let me listen to that most annoying theme song to 'Boy Meets World' JUST ONE MORE TIME!"

    Give it up ABC. Why not take friday nights and put on back to back episodes of the Drew Carey Show and Who's Line is it Anyway? like you did all week long during the last few months?

    Or howabout a new "reality television" show called "Who Wants to be a Pauper?" where we watch failed contestants from "Who Wants to be a Millionare" try to survive among the nations homeless eating rats and fishing street drains for cigarette butts? (Each week one of the contestants would be voted out and forced to play "Big Brother" - a fate worse than "MTV's Real World". The final contestant gets a chance to slap Regis and choke him with his monocrome tie.
  • "Hi, this is Rand Race. I'm in a drug induced stupor right now and cannot find the phone. If you are a telemarketer please take me off your list and fuck off after the beep. If you are an aquantaince you should know I never listen to my messages so call back later.... (beep)"

    I wonder if an automated system telling another automated system to remove the first automated system from the calling list of the second automated system would work? Probably require yet another automated system to edit the list.

  • US Code Title 47, Section 227 [cornell.edu] makes this a very profitable enterprise for the victim. Some helpful extracts:

    (3) The term ''telephone solicitation'' means the initiation of a telephone call or message for the purpose of encouraging the purchase or rental of, or investment in, property, goods, or services, which is transmitted to any person, [unless based on a prior relationship]

    It shall be unlawful for any person within the United States ... (B) to initiate any telephone call to any residential telephone line using an artificial or prerecorded voice to deliver a message without the prior express consent of the called party, unless the call is initiated for emergency purposes or is exempted by rule or order by the Commission under paragraph (2)(B);

    (3) Private right of action A person or entity may, if otherwise permitted by the laws or rules of court of a State, bring in an appropriate court of that State - (A) an action based on a violation of this subsection or the regulations prescribed under this subsection to enjoin such violation, (B) an action to recover for actual monetary loss from such a violation, or to receive $500 in damages for each such violation, whichever is greater, [emphasis added] or (C) both such actions. If the court finds that the defendant willfully or knowingly violated this subsection or the regulations prescribed under this subsection, the court may, in its discretion, increase the amount of the award to an amount equal to not more than 3 times the amount available under subparagraph (B) of this paragraph.

    In other words, if ABC calls you and either (a) hangs up without talking to you or (b) leaves a prerecorded message on your answering machine, you can take them to small-claims court and get somewhere between $500 and $1500. Not bad for a day's work!

    Incidentally, this is the same section that prohibits junk faxes. It can be pretty profitable to read the entire statute.

  • In college I had a roommate that always said he was going to start talking sexy to them if they were a woman. Now, he was a nice guy and couldn't bring himself to do it... Well he and I stayed up for like 2 days studing for something. (He was the brightest, but he tried hard). So it was like 10am and we had both been asleep for *maybe* 5 hours (after nearly 48 of being awake).


    Phone rings, and I answer:
    me: "what?"
    [5 second pause...i knew it was coming]
    her: "good morning, I'm calling for...blah blah blah blah" [i let her talk for about 30 seconds... I was about to hang up and then I got an idea..]
    me: "wait a second...let me ask you a question about the interest rate, I'm confused. Is that okay?"
    her: "Sure!"
    me: [deep i-want-you voice]"what are you wearing?"
    her: "what?"
    me: "what are you wearning? is it pink. i like pink."
    her: "am I wearing anything PINK? THAT'S NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS."
    me: "huh. geez. you could at least talk dirty to me... just like mom use to."

    at that point she got all upset and hung up.

    nonetheless, we got a kick out of it... reminded me of the Seinfield episode.

    ---
  • Ok. Lets see, what idiot came up with this plan in the first place, and how did it almost happen (even if it was canned). I mean, we all HATE spam in our inbox. I know that execs at ABC by now realize that we don't want unsolicited ads in our e-mail (though the thought probably occurred to them).

    In my e-mail box, I can read the subject ahead of time, and delete it.

    On my voicemail, I have to wait for that slow voice to read out all of the info on the message, or even play the darn thing, before I can burn it.

    Goodness, I'd rather get spam in my e-mail from them.

    Besides, how freaking effective do these idiots think such a marketting tactics would be. I mean, I don't always listen to a friend, a critic, or a stranger telling me to watch shows. Now an annoying machine, which is the only message on my machine will do the same thing.

    "Hello Dungeon Dweller. We know that we are the only message on your machine, that you have no friends and no life, so we decided to tell you that all of the cool people are watching 'Suddenly Susan' and her quirky antics. Byeeeeee."

    Yeah, that will sell great.


    We're all different.

  • Re:Is this even legal? (Score:5)

    by PD ( 9577 ) <slashdotlinux@pdrap.org> on Monday July 24, 2000 @10:23AM (#909211) Homepage Journal
    Here's your answer from the relevant US laws:

    From Subpart L - Restrictions on Telephone Solicitation

    a.2.Initiate any telephone call to any residential telephone line using an artificial or prerecorded voice to deliver a message without the prior express consent of the called party, unless the call is initiated for emergency purposes or is exempted by sec. 64.1200(c)

    section c says this:

    c.The term "telephone call" in sec. 64.1200(a)(2) shall not include a call or message by, or on behalf of, a caller:
    1.that is not made for a commercial purpose,
    2.that is made for a commercial purpose but does not include the transmission of any unsolicited advertisement,
    3.to any person with whom the caller has an established business relationship at the time the call is made, or
    4.which is a tax-exempt nonprofit organization.

    So there you go! ABC is giving out $500 checks to everyone who is lucky enough to get a call! Make sure you save those answering machine tapes, boys and girls. The small claims court judge will want to listen to them. While you're at it, go over to www.junkbusters.com and print out a copy of the legislation for the judge. It should be a very easy case to win.
  • I'd rather have messages on my machine, it only takes a second to delete if you've got a digial answerer and you don't have to go through the trouble of talking to the (often) moronic people on the line. However, what ABC is doing seems illegal, but I'm not sure on that, wonder if they got all the numbers off people sigining up for Who Wants to be a Millionaire?

    TM: Hi, this is [name] from [Big Marketing Company]. Would you be interested in...?
    Me: No thanks.
    TM: Are you confident?
    Me: Yes.
    TM: Is that your final answer?
    Me: That is my final answer.
    [Game show sounds in background]
    TM: No, I'm sorry. That is the wrong answer.

    =================================

  • Is this even legal? (Score:5)

    by crow ( 16139 ) on Monday July 24, 2000 @09:54AM (#909216) Homepage Journal
    With normal telemarketing calls, US law says that I can tell them to put me on their do-not-call list, and they have to pay a $500 penalty if they then do call me (assuming I'm willing to go to the hassle of taking them to small claims court).

    With this, they hang up before I can ask to be put on that list. Does the law that requires them to honor such requests allow this?

    And what about bans on computer calling? Or do they have a real human talk to the answering machine (talk about a boring job)?
  • There's a radio station nearby where I live in the Bay Area that also drops such crap on your answering machine. I'd be rather pissed if I only got part of a message because the memory on my answering machine (I've got a digital answering machine, thus I said memory, not tape :) ) ran out because part of it was filled with an ADVERTISEMENT.
  • It seems like they are trying to get around the "please take me off your calling list" laws that many states have adopted. The jist of it is that if "Big Company" calls you, you can tell them to take you off their calling list. If "Big Company" calls you again, you can take them to court and win some money. Each subsequent call from "Big Company" means a bigger cash settlement for you. The only proof you need to supply is the date and time that "Big Company" called.

    If they never talk to a human, though, then they will never be subject to this law. Seems pretty sneaky to me.


    ------------------------------------------------ ----------------

  • Go to http://www.the-dma.org/ and hunt around -- you'll find that you can OPT OUT of telemarketing, EMail marketing and EMail.

    It does work.

    --
  • Candidate records a message, or has a heavy hitter speak on their behalf, and it gets pushed out, and hangs up if a real person answers, as it is only a computer on the other end.

    matt
  • My message says, "I'm not home. Think fast....beeep". At least once a day I get a message from a telemarketer along these lines: "Hello......hello.......may I speak to Greg Mizell?.....hello......click" Apparently they just can't think quite that fast.
  • Call rejection is a scam. You pay to have anonymous calls blocked. OK, fine so far.

    The problem is that the phone company turns around and offers a service to businesses: blocked anonymous call rejection override. That way, the businesses that pay the fee can still get through.

    They need to start selling is a blocked anonymous call rejection override override.
  • Yeah, the moderation on this was unfair. People should read the parent comments before moderating. /. does not provide a mechanism for conversation other than the posting forum, and therefore, answers and replies to such things are perfectly acceptable. Besides, this is a weblog, we're not writing a daggon book. What, do you really think that someday people are going to start buying the /. archives in paperback (not a bad idea ). At any rate, it may not describe heisman's uncertainty principle in relation to dickheads calling you with machines and leaving spam on your answering machine, but it is relevant converstation to the parent post. Those moderating this post, please read the parent as well.


    We're all different.

  • "I feel a distrubates in the force" - ObiWan

    Soon as some spammer pirates a copy of this software, all hell is going to break lose. Phone rings constanly, but everytime you answer it, it disconnects. You come home from work and have an entire tape filled with 500 messages, or 4 hours of "voice spam".

    Oh you don't think it will happen? Phone numbers are easy to get compared to email address. In fact most, if not all cities organsize a list for free, avaiable to spammers of "live" phone numbers, it is called the phone book.

  • Would going down the phone book alphabetically and dialling every third hispanic sounding name be illegal?

    Not necessarily illegal, but the phone company would be after you.

    The phone company uses its resources to circulate information for us (its customers) in the form of a phone book. This is to be used for looking up phone numbers of people you know.

    If you were to use the phone book for telemarketing or snail mail advertising, you would eventually get a "dummy" mailbox. This phone number and address do not exist, because there is no real person associated to it.

    The phone company uses this to catch people would are using the phone book for advertising.

    You then get a lawsuit filed against you for theft of services or something like that. The person I know settled out of court.

    I heard about this 2nd hand from a teacher at the U. of Pittsburgh.

    -d9
  • I believe it's also illegal to setup a machine for dialing blocks of numbers to call. Hence the reason they are aiming for the answering machines.

    Somebody in the Marketing dept. who took a Law 101 class trying to find a loophole?

    Malk-a-mite

  • They have already caned this plan (Score:5)

    by jon323456 ( 194737 ) on Monday July 24, 2000 @09:56AM (#909251)
    According to the NYTimes, they killed this plan already: "ABC has backed away from a controversial plan to use sitcom stars like Norm MacDonald to promote its fall lineup by leaving taped messages on the home answering machines of viewers. The decision came after the network, known for aggressively seeking ... July 22, 2000, Saturday "
  • I'm sick of these bastards. They call and you're like "hello? hello?" for 20 seconds until it multiplexes you over to some idiot who is going to sell you stuff. Of course, they usually call for my parents and I end up interrogating them:

    Telemarketer: Hello, is Mr. Tosh there?
    Me: Yes he's here, what is this in relation to?
    Telemarketer: We'd like to sell him a...
    Me: He's got better things to do than talk to you.
    *click*

    I'd rather have messages on my machine, it only takes a second to delete if you've got a digial answerer and you don't have to go through the trouble of talking to the (often) moronic people on the line. However, what ABC is doing seems illegal, but I'm not sure on that, wonder if they got all the numbers off people sigining up for Who Wants to be a Millionaire?

  • So which would you rather deal with
    Telemarketers (yeah sure you give me YOUR home phone# and I'll call you when I'm free)

    Annoying Pauses wehn you DO answer the phone (I usually hang up on them immediately, or let them try to sell their product to my three year old who just LOOOVES to talk on the phone)

    or a telemarketer who hangs up when you answer (I agree with the above poster about that being a little disconcerting)

    well I guess they went the way of door-to-door salesmen... What's the next great Arthur Miller Spin off..... Death of a Telemarketer (Spammer)???

  • tele-solicitors (Score:3)

    by wishus ( 174405 ) on Monday July 24, 2000 @09:57AM (#909260) Journal
    The answering machine is the big city where I live.. I get at least one call every day that is a hang up, and while I can't attribute all of those to this kind of marketing, I would venture to guess most of them are by the number of recorded solicitations that appear in my voicemail.

    I recently bought an answering machine with 3 separate mailboxes.. You have to push *2 or *3 to leave a message in boxes 2 or 3, but if you don't press anything it defaults to box 1. My friends and family know to press the "secret code" so I can easily discern between messages I want to hear and messages I probably don't.

    I toyed with the idea of charging for telephone solicitations, and even called a few companies back to get their mailing address so I could send them an invoice. Most of these were local businesses, horrified at the thought and instantly put me on their do-not-call list. I never followed through with the actual mailing of invoices, but no one called my bluff either.

    of course, someone will post the obligatory link to junkbusters' telemarketing script, but that doesn't really help with these machine calls, so i won't bother.

    wishus
    ---

  • Hmm... I would bet that the same thing could be done with mgetty fairly easily. That way I wouldn't have to pay for a special Caller-ID box, I would have yet another excuse to tinker with my Linux box, and I could say that my solution "ran on Linux."

    Now just imagine a beowulf cluster of those babies!

  • Now i gotta install portsentry on my goddamn answering machine. *pfffffffffffffffffft*

    --

  • Re:Federal law applies to ALL states (Score:5)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday July 24, 2000 @10:34AM (#909276)
    According to the Federal Trade Commission this would be an "Abusive telemarketing acts or practices" [ftc.gov] when a telemarketting person or devices doesn't provide the required oral disclosures aren't provided.

    The details are:

    (d) Required oral disclosures. It is an abusive telemarketing act or practice and a violation of this Rule for a telemarketer in an outbound telephone call to fail to disclose promptly and in a clear and conspicuous manner to the person receiving the call, the following information: (1) The identity of the seller; ...

    Since the ABC telemarketing device (and I believe advertizing television shows still falls under telemarketing acts) will purposily fail to identify itself, I believe this is an attempt on ABC to intentionally conduct an "abusive telemarketing practice."

  • My roommate and I were getting annoyed by apparant prank callers (the caller would hangup when we picked up, and would never leave a message). We called the phone company, who forwarded us to some place that deals with (i think) telemarketing calls, and they said that it was perfectly O.K. (I'm in Indiana, by the way). The excuse they gave was that sometimes the telemarketers' machines dial numbers, and when someone picks up, if no human on the telemarketer's side is available to talk, that it simply hangs up. I call it harrasing phone calls; they call it normal business.
  • It's the Direct Marketing Association, guy. They have some pretty stringent rules, and I believe that there are some laws that require direct marketers to follow the rules.

    c/"EMail marketing"/"Junk Mail marketing"/ btw.

    It works. I called in and demanded that I be removed from the telemarketing and bulk mail lists. I *do not* receive telemarketing calls from any large businesses any more. The exceedingly few calls I've received have been from local carpet cleaners, and my own bank doing surveys.

    I get far less junk mail than I used to. It's not all gone, by any means, but it *is* reduced.

    I haven't attempted the EMail opt out. I don't believe it would be at all effective: most of the junk EMail I receive is obviously from nincompoops who wouldn't belong to the DMA.


    --

  • While I was chatting with someone (Probably on icb, I don't think I was into irc at the time) I got call-nuked by a church's automated invitation service. Since then I've had an unreasoning hatred of schemes like this.

    Now if only there were a physical copper connection between them and me so I could run some wicked voltage to them...

Slashdot Top Deals

Remember the good old days, when CPU was singular?

Close