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IBM Tells Employees To Hold Off WinXP SP2 325
robpoe writes "As reported by ZDNet, IBM's technology department has warned internal users to not install Windows XP SP2 until IBM can fix some known issues with the way IE6 is updated, and Big Blue can make a customized version of the patch - 'The company's technology department said the delay is 'due to known application problems and incompatibility with IBM workstation applications.''" However, the article also mentions that: "One IBM employee in the company's internal technology department characterized the decision as routine."
Scary headline (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Scary headline (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Scary headline (Score:2)
Re:Scary headline (Score:5, Funny)
It should only really be scary if you're installing it and you work for IBM...
Re:Scary headline (Score:2, Troll)
Is Microsoft intentionally making the patches not play nicely with IBM software? It wouldn't be the first time, would it? No, I don't have a tinfoil hat on, but IF IBM gets cozier with Novell (or buys it) it will be positioned to be Microsoft's competition with SuSE, which is argueably the best distro for home users and the business desktop.
Re:Scary headline (Score:5, Interesting)
This is typical of every large company, I'm betting over 90$ of large american corperations have a hold off SP2 order in their IT departments right now.
Re:Scary headline (Score:5, Funny)
So if not *every* large company does this, does that mean you'll pay me $90?
Re:Scary headline (Score:4, Funny)
You want me to post as if i was a thick spread made from mashed chickpeas, tahini, lemon juice and garlic? And you're making jokes about typos?
--
cHris
Re:Scary headline (Score:2)
I've tested the RC's with our product (I'm a tester), so the final release of XP SP2 isn't a shocker - we know the implications of running our product on it....
Re:Scary headline (Score:2, Insightful)
*snort*
What color bridge would you like, sir?
Re:Scary headline (Score:3, Insightful)
My methodology has always been to watch the history of updates from a given source. After a couple of years of updates that do more good than harm you trust them enough to apply them almost immediately. I say almost because you at least try it on a few test machines first, but this can be done within hours of the updates availability.
What you do after not one, but several bad updates, those that break key components and fix problems that you don't even have, or claim to fix problems but
Re:Scary headline (Score:3, Informative)
Our company has 50,000 desktops.. guess how many builds we have..
3.
Sure, you get the odd niche group who do customized dev work, they run their own build, and do their own IT, but we aren't responsible for upgrading them. So yeah. 3.
We're all reloading Slashdot for problems (Score:5, Funny)
Another site to check are some of the gaming forums. If it doesn't trash Doom3 and the Slashbots pretending to work don't report problems, it must be OK.
Re:Scary headline (Score:2)
This is normal for an enterprise. (Score:5, Insightful)
This is a pretty big patch, and people have known for a while that it's going to change the way some things work. It makes sense to show caution before allowing a mass deployment. There's not much news here.
Re:This is normal for an enterprise. (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:This is normal for an enterprise. (Score:2, Informative)
On a side note, the service pack is actually released, and totals 266MB (272,391KB).
Exactly my thoughts. (Score:3, Interesting)
Side note: just went cruising dell's site for any word on putting sp2 on the gf's new Dimension xps and didn't see much mention of it by way of "don't do this yet" or "my god people hurry and install", so i'm going to call tech support (i heard that chuckle) and see what they have to say on the matter. Prolly have it down by rote at this point after getting more than a few calls about it. If it were my pc, i'd do it just to see all the stuff an
Re:This is normal for an enterprise. (Score:3, Interesting)
It is routine! (Score:5, Informative)
Re:It is routine! (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:It is routine! (Score:2)
No, IBM should be using Tivoli Software Deployment.
-l
Re:It is routine! (Score:3, Informative)
Re:It is routine! (Score:4, Informative)
http://www.ibm.com/tivoli
Re:It is routine! (Score:2)
Ted Tschopp
Re:It is routine! (Score:5, Funny)
Does the heldesk monkey know that your refer to him by such an unflattering term?
Re:It is routine! (Score:2, Funny)
You left out an "L".
Re:It is routine! (Score:5, Funny)
Yep... rm -rf * tends to give you a lot more space.
Re:It is routine! (Score:3, Interesting)
What site is this? (Score:5, Funny)
WinXPServicePackNews.com?
The same as any large organisation? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:The same as any large organisation? (Score:5, Informative)
Re:The same as any large organisation? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:The same as any large organisation? (Score:2)
So no all corporations are the same....
SP2 - Admin Rights Required? (Score:2)
So is this message really for IT then?
Re:The same as any large organisation? (Score:2)
Re:The same as any large organisation? (Score:2)
If you don't appreciate the types of internal application that a company like IBM will have then you don't appreciate the type of organisation that IBM is.
Although one who does might also interpret the comment you replied to as a joke. Especially since Microsoft patches have historically broken Lotus Notes...
Re:The same as any large organisation? (Score:2)
Re:The same as any large organisation? (Score:2)
I was forced to use it back in 1996 and again in 2003, and it was just as horrible in 2003 as it was in '96. It doesn't even conform to the most fundamental Windows UI practices. Of course, the irony is that it's just like everything else IBM makes.
Microsoft at least tries to mak
Re:The same as any large organisation? (Score:2)
Um... It runs well under Wine?
Actually, most IBM (windows) software runs well under Wine. Me thinks it's because IBM uses published APIs for development and not MS "secret sauce"...
Companies should hold off (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Companies should hold off (Score:2)
In related news... (Score:5, Funny)
Oh, nevermind... my bad. That was just my screensaver and someone unplugged my mouse.
The only thing necessary for Micro$oft to triumph is for a few good programmers to do nothing". North County Computers [nccomp.com]
It's not a big deal (Score:5, Interesting)
Helpful Deployment Tools Here [microsoft.com]
Internal IBM website (Score:2)
PR (Score:5, Insightful)
And of course, the first thing that happens is, this internal memo somehow finds its way to ZDNet. Looks like PR FUD to me.
It's good though, at least Microsoft gets a little of its own medicine once in a while...
Indeed. (Score:4, Informative)
This is especially important for XP SP2, because it does break a lot of stuff. In particular, it breaks the (enterprise class) products we produce in several places (I personally am working on our own hotfixes to be sent out ASAP). This is the sort of problem companies like IBM want to avoid. So, all things considered, this is a total non story.
Allegedly ... (Score:5, Funny)
One Microsoft employee in the company's unspecified division of vaguery was alleged to have characterized a response which resembled "We OWNZ you biatch!".
No really, they did.
As an IBMer myself ... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:As an IBMer myself ... (Score:2, Insightful)
If that isn't a damning testimony to the abuse of ActiveX, I don't know what is.
People, if an IE update might break something important, then you have seriously fucked up your whole approach to computers.
Re:As an IBMer myself ... (Score:2)
(IBMer for the summer...)
This sure is unheard of. (Score:5, Funny)
I bet they're just sucking up (Score:2, Funny)
how do you stop users from d/l SP2? (Score:2)
Re:how do you stop users from d/l SP2? (Score:2, Informative)
While you're at it... (Score:2)
Re:While you're at it... (Score:2)
"lynx for windows"
Lynx! (Score:2)
Understanble (Score:5, Insightful)
Rus
But of course... (Score:3, Funny)
No Wonder. WinXP SP2 installation woes. (Score:3, Interesting)
The installation went fine except that somewhere in the middle of the installation I got "Access is denied." error. The installation program then went and de-installed what was partially installed and restored it to SP1 (Thank Goodness!). This was while logged in (as the only user in the system) with administrative privileges. Windows was rebooted and it booted fine in SP1.
I rebooted SP1 in Safe mode and logged in as the Administrator. I repeated the installation process with exact same error "Access is denied.". Again, reverted to SP1 successfully
I am thankful that it was possible to change back to SP1 and WinXP booted. But, I just can't seem to be able to install SP2. Now, I am scared than earlier about trying it for the third time.
Osho
Re:No Wonder. WinXP SP2 installation woes. (Score:3, Informative)
I posted a query on a MS newsgroup and got a response from an MVP that indicated that it was a rights issue, that I didn't have rights to modify some section of my registry.
My suspicion is that this problem resulted from my machine having being a member of two differen
what is this malarkey ? (Score:2, Insightful)
Prudent of IBM (Score:3, Insightful)
IBM is being prudent in this case, because of the issues they identified with well known applications and their internal applications. I wouldn't be surprised if the are also holding off on the update until some of their internal applications are updated. A large portion of the company probably relys on these applications, and updating would cause too much downtime. They probably identifed the issues with these applications during the SP2 beta cycle, have updated them, and are beginning the process of updating images and rolling them out.
That being said, I'm wondering if we'll start seeing announcements from other companies that are doing the same thing. I'm thinking that HP probably has as many PCs if not more than IBM.
Wow. Right on top of things IBM! (Score:2)
Of course, this IS from the company that brought us Y2K.
regular IBM practice? May be not ... (Score:3, Insightful)
Personally, I'm going to hold on with this patch as well. Why do I need it anyway? When I ru Windows (and I have a dual boot), I only use Mozilla as a browser, have firewall, Active-X tracker, always up to date virus scanner, and several spybot scanners/detectors. So I would rather hold on till, say, the end of this year -- when dust settles down
FedEx SP2 Issues (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Funny (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Funny (Score:3, Funny)
You should try to stay INSIDE more often. Why go outside to interact with humanity when there are so many things to read on /.
Sexy Man (Score:4, Funny)
Informative (Score:5, Informative)
Interesting (Score:4, Interesting)
Underrated (Score:5)
Re:Funny (Score:5, Informative)
What does this patch do for you? Well, I've been using RC2 for awhile, and here's what it's done for me:
1) Broken Thief III such that when I load levels, my computer crashes.
2) Screams bloody murder when an app opens a port - except for loopback - but even when I explicitly wanted that port opened it still raises a dialog.
3) Messed up MSN Instant Messenger's hotmail addin so it now links to Outlook and Outlook Express even though I don't even USE Outlook.
4) Messed up my MSN Instant Messenger buddy list by trying to group them into random categories I didn't even want
5) Installed more gooblygook into Windows Media Player that asks for copyright protections etc that I don't want and makes me go through the configuration screen all over again
6) Added a popup blocker I didn't want - that I can't easily turn off - into IE - that conflicts with Google Toolbar - instead of one easy click to get a popup on a site that you were expecting to pop up (such as a separate chat window for customer support), you now need to go into the options to turn popup blocking off, then click the google toolbar... twice the hassle.
And other nice oddities.
I say, wait until this beast has been patched...there's nothing worth running out for.
Re:Funny (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Funny (Score:3, Informative)
It fixes alot of well known vulnerabilities, adds some great features to the firewall, adds a popup blocker, and the Security Center provides great support for some well-known virus scanners to make sure users are up to date on virus definitions.
Installed more gooblygook into Windows Media Player that asks for copyright protections etc that I don't want and makes me go through the configuration screen all over again
What gooblygook does it install into WMP? Or do you me
This is Standard Practice for IBM (Score:5, Informative)
Re:This is Standard Practice for IBM (Score:2)
Seriously, ALL big companies (IBM, HP et all) do this. I mean c'mon, if there are hundreds and thousands of computers running on the company network and all of them install the untested patch... well you know. Thats what I call a real life Doom 3.
Any half decent system admin will not let anyone install the SP unless it has been tested against essential software like their email client, VPN, payroll and other critical apps.
Re:This is Standard Practice for IBM (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:This is Standard Practice for IBM (Score:2)
Re:This is Standard Practice for IBM (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Funny (Score:5, Informative)
So a routine decision makes the front page of Slashdot, clearly advertized as "IBM doesn't trust Microsoft".
The basic anti MS movement is still out there.
Re:Funny (Score:2)
Certainly sounds to me like they don't trust Microsoft.
Chris Mattern
Re:Funny (Score:3, Insightful)
Companies have a difficult balance... testing patches and updates to software to ensure compatibility for their context, while getting patches in place to address vulnerabilities.
Anyways, I need to get back to trying to fix my Windows XP desktop at work. SP2 broke it severely, and I'm not doing a repair re-install of XP for the second time to try to get the damn thing operational again. Good thing I only run Win
Re:Funny (Score:5, Insightful)
The fact that they are cautious doesn't mean they distrust SP2. Like any major upgrage to a kernel (to any OS), it is going to break some of your specific devs, would it be only slightly.
This would be true for any OS. The fact that this one is Microsoft doesn't make it something against MS.
Re:Funny (Score:3, Insightful)
After working for the company for the past two summers as an intern, I've come to know a bunch of people who actually *gasp* work there. I'd say that 1/2 of them are Linux geeks who understand that while Linux is great and all, it will not cure AIDS, feed the poor, or save the whales/children. Neither will Windows. They're fucking OS's that you can either RUN or NOT RUN. Choose one an
Re:Huh? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Huh? (Score:2)
These problems are beyond a simple firewall... (Score:2)
Nasty worms like this don't care about Internet access so much as they like to flood local LANS filled with unpatched computers. That's why, when I see companies or hospitals who don't patch before extensiv
Re:These problems are beyond a simple firewall... (Score:2)
And nobody's saying it is a great solution- but when we're talking about a patch that just a few days ago caused 3 out of 5 computers it was applied to to fail to reboot- and given Microsoft's reputation for bugs- it can be more expensive to apply the patch without testing than it can be to delay a bit.
Re:These problems are beyond a simple firewall... (Score:2)
Re:Huh? (Score:5, Informative)
Specifically it was NOT addressed to clients (note Sam doens't call them customers anymore).
It was a letter on the IBM Intranet addressed to the 300,000+ IBMers (for reference, I am one. I've read the letter. Of course, I do NOT speak for IBM). The letter does not mention specifics, but IBM develops a TON of software for use internally. These applications have to be tested with SP2 before they release SP2 internally.
This is completely routine, and has been done on many patches before this one. It is IBM being cautious and testing a new component with the thousands of other pieces of software that keep IBM moving. I for one, am glad our IT staff takes the time to do this.
Re:What about Linux (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Call me Capt. Obvious... (Score:2, Interesting)
Besides, the problems with SP2 involve webbed and internet apps. Anything that opens up a port causes the new SP2 firewall to throw up all sorts of alarms, unless it's local loopback only.
Re:Caution is good (Score:3, Informative)
Check your facts before you post. [microsoft.com]
Re:Caution is good (Score:2)
not only hotfixes but now there's this 250mb mega patch that you're supposed to install on sp1'd machines!
Re:SCARY! (Score:2, Informative)
As many as I could get (Score:2)
How does this get modded as informative? I'll be the first to burn MS as the stake, but IBM isn't rolling out because they failed to udpat
Re:Isn't MS supposed to... (Score:2)
The article says it causes problems with some IBM internal applications. Microsoft probably does not run those applications.
If SP2 breaks third party software that is installed on business critical machines (e.g. laptop of person working on 8 figure deal), a sensible company will not install it. IBM is not the only company working on known problems with SP2, and issuing "do not install" memos internally.
Re:Wow. (Score:2)
Ah, no. It isn't FUD. They just don't want SP2 to break any existing internal applications that run on XP. If you read just about every other posting on this article, you'd understand what I am talking about.