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Sony Delays PlayStation Network Reactivation 317

Posted by timothy
from the toes-in-the-hostile-waters dept.
i4u writes "Earlier this week chatter in an IRC network led to speculation of a third attack on Sony's network. For its part, the company steadfastly promised that at least some services would resume by the end of this week. But now it looks like Sony has given up on that goal. The PSN reactivation has been delayed. Sony's explanation? They were 'unaware' of the extent of the attacks on their system."
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Sony Delays PlayStation Network Reactivation

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  • Not Aware? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Squiddie (1942230) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @05:19PM (#36066108)
    Well, what ARE they doing scheduling reactivation if they are not aware of the extent of the attacks? Something tells me that Sony just has poor handle on everything security related.
    • by Mashiki (184564)

      Sony security is handled with 3 chimps and a hamster. You can't expect anything more from that motley crew, except the complete works of Shakespeare done on a typewriter.

    • Re:Not Aware? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by node 3 (115640) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @06:31PM (#36066654)

      Well, what ARE they doing scheduling reactivation if they are not aware of the extent of the attacks? Something tells me that Sony just has poor handle on everything security related.

      Really? This is something you are berating Sony for?

      They are doing the exact right thing here. First, they assessed the damage and worked to get PSN up as fast as possible. During that process, they discovered that the intrusion was more extensive than they thought, and instead of simply bringing PSN back up on their original schedule, they are allowing new information to alter their plans.

      If this were some Linux archive, like for example sourceforge, or the Debian repositories, and they did the exact same thing, you'd be heaping praise upon them for doing the right thing and not adhering to bullshit corporate image demands, but since it's Sony who's doing the right thing, it must be bad somehow, right?

      • by Valen0 (325388)

        Debian.org was compromised back in 2003. You can read a blow-by-blow account of the attack at: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2003/11/msg00012.html [debian.org] and http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2003/12/msg00001.html [debian.org]

        It took Debian about 3 weeks to get all affected services back online after the attack.

    • Re:Not Aware? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by TemperedAlchemist (2045966) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @06:47PM (#36066808)

      And something tells me you should read up on your computer forensics. Not knowing the extent of the damage immediately is common in most computer forensics investigation. At the end of the day you're simply pointing your finger at Sony without evidence or legitimate reason. Skepticism is good, criticism without reason or evidence is foolish.

  • Who & Why (Score:5, Interesting)

    by F34nor (321515) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @05:26PM (#36066172)

    is this black hat or revenge for the removal of install other os?

    • by somersault (912633) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @05:33PM (#36066244) Homepage Journal

      Yay, let's take revenge on the removal of OtherOS by removing the remaining features from our PlayStations, and those of all our friends! Pissing off the gaming community is sure to garner their support and goodwill!

      • Re:Who & Why (Score:5, Interesting)

        by fuzzyfuzzyfungus (1223518) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @05:46PM (#36066348) Journal
        My suspicion(totally without any unusual knowledge, of course) is that it is a mixture: The core penetrations, and the exfiltration of CC details and other identity-thefty stuff look a lot like the usual commercially motivated electronic criminal activity. However, the sorts of people who do that are opportunists, and generally not morons: Sony's current deep unpopularity with a segment of ideological hackers/bored 4channers likely provides both a certain amount of 'free' security testing done by third parties and then dumped into forums and chatrooms, there for the taking, and provides a certain amount of concealment: If only through sheer bulk, wading through all the not-too-competent attacks mounted by assorted under-18s who would probably get a month in juvy and are barely worth hunting down, in order to pick out the sophisticated operators is going to be rather more difficult than just finding the sophisticated operators.

        As for the support/goodwill thing, I suspect that those doing the attacks aren't really interested in that. The professional thieves, of course, don't care; because they are there for the money. Any ideological attackers don't care because they are there to make Sony bleed and/or clearly demonstrate the vulnerability of services and hardware cryptographically locked to a single service. The support of Sony's customers is worthless to them; because(by design) Sony's customers have basically no power. Creating as much angst and suffering among those customers, on the other hand(in addition to any amusement that might be derived) hurts Sony's commercial standing.
      • They can just not play games that require an online connection.
        And if they have a problem with it, I'm sure there is a line in the EULA that gives Sony the right to shut down the PSN.

      • Re:Who & Why (Score:4, Insightful)

        by shutdown -p now (807394) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @07:03PM (#36066912) Journal

        Pissing off the gaming community is sure to garner their support and goodwill!

        Given that OtherOS was always a geek feature, there was never any support to speak of in the first place. The majority of PS users simply didn't care (and many didn't even know to care).

        On the other hand, right now, Sony's image is significantly tarnished by them not being able to deal with the problem for so long. They can blame it on hackers all they want, but it's abundantly clear by now that it's also a matter of their incompetence that lead to the hack in the first place, and delays their efforts to recover. In the end, users don't really matter - all they know is that PSN is down (and will remain down, per TFA) while e.g Xbox Live works just fine.

        So, as far as garnering support goes, this hack is definitely not taking any points. But as pure spiteful revenge? It's wildly successful, if you ask me.

        • ...and it certainly doesn't help that it happened the week of the release of Portal 2 and Mortal Kombat.

          Hell, I haven't played Portal 2 Co-Op yet because PSN isn't up and my grand plan was to buy the PS3 version, redeem the PC copy to my Steam account, then have my nephew come over, log on his own PSN/Steam accounts so we could play MP together while only buying one copy. We both beat the single player the same day PSN went down.

      • Re:Who & Why (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Z34107 (925136) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @07:22PM (#36067004)

        Yay, let's take revenge on the removal of OtherOS by removing the remaining features from our PlayStations, and those of all our friends! Pissing off the gaming community is sure to garner their support and goodwill!

        The "gaming community"? Do you mean the petulant whiners who think George Hotz is paying his lawyers in stolen CC numbers? Or the ones who seem completely oblivious to the months of identity theft hell they're about to face because of Sony's incompetence?

        Of course, leaving all that information completely unsecured would've been perfectly okay, if not for those meddling kids.

        In seriousness, Sony's incompetence is borderline illegal. But, you think this is homebrew's fault?

    • Re:Who & Why (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Pharmboy (216950) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @05:58PM (#36066430) Journal

      Occam's Razor may apply. - I thought I read that they were running an unpatched version of Apache on a system without a firewall, including here on /. The motive could have simply been "low hanging fruit with a high return". The real question is "why the hell did it take so long for someone to pwn them?"

      Assigning it to "them black hat hackers" seems akin to them blaming Anonymous. Normally, if it was done for hactivism, someone would have taken credit for it by now. The simplest explanation would appear to be that they did it to make money.

    • by jthill (303417)

      No, because the white hats figured out how to put the feature back, and stopped there. Everyone could have stopped there, and it'd all be cool.

      The bad part started with GeoHot cracking the second key and Sony taking vengeance. That opened the floodgates. What's happening now is the real underworld criminals, seeing ready-made scapegoats and knowing Sony will perceive an advantage in blaming those, decided on a mutually-advantageous transaction.

  • My senses suggest me that the theft of personal data is just a coveup story by Sony.
    I think some angry hacker just wiped out their servers, and backups are as usual stored on /dev/null.
    And so they have to rebuild the whole thing.
    Anyway revenge is complete regardless of whom did that.
    Sad that users are possibly affected as well.

    • by Lunix Nutcase (1092239) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @05:29PM (#36066194)

      My senses suggest me that the theft of personal data is just a coveup story by Sony.

      Because Sony would want to willingly pay for millions of dollars in identity theft services when no personal data was taken?

      • by Lifyre (960576)

        It makes for a decent PR move regardless of anything being taken and helps reinforce the story that it was a theft operation. I'm not passing judgement on the validity of either theory.

        • by bloodhawk (813939) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @06:05PM (#36066488)
          It doesn't make sense at all, a complete disaster where everything unrecoverable would be a far better story than 100 million accounts stolen both from a PR point of view and from a monetary point of view. The current situation will see them stuck in legal and financial problems for years to come not to mention a serious loss of faith with consumers.
          • by DarkOx (621550)

            I agree with your assessment it makes no sense at all form them say the account information was stolen unless they either know it was or can't be sure it was not. If they knew the data was not leaked they would not be writing checks for identity theft protection.

            I don't understand the big mystery here. I suspect the issue is there is something very fundamentally broken about how the PSN does authentication and or authorization, and they can't figure out a way to fix it without breaking all the existing so

    • by JamesP (688957)

      I think some angry hacker just wiped out their servers, and backups are as usual stored on /dev/null.

      Well, silly them! I always put my backups on /dev/random. Never had a problem recovering them.

      Of course, my db stores Youtube comments, so your mileage may vary...

  • And? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by coffii (76089) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @05:31PM (#36066220)

    I cant say I'm surprised, if they have to rebuild their network expect it to take months, this really isnt a case of patching a windows server and rebooting.

    I expect one of the things keeping them offline will be the credit card companies, they are probably the ones in control right now.

  • What are they, trying to write their own web server from a scratch?

    Besides, they will probably get an earful from the "security companies" they have hired, because it implies that even after all the audits not all security holes were found.

  • by Lose (1901896) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @05:37PM (#36066270)
    They're having problems re-sorting all their credit card data stored on the admin's desktop by penis again. They must not have taken a screenshot.

    This could take ages.
  • Original source (Score:4, Informative)

    by Chris Mattern (191822) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @05:37PM (#36066288)

    If you'd like to actually ready what Sony has to say for themselves instead of giving clicks to the self-promoting second-hand site: http://blog.us.playstation.com/2011/05/06/service-restoration-update/ [playstation.com]

    • this blows. we should all go out and kill anyone who claims to be anonymous, this is freaking stupid go away you dam hackers

      This was the only post that mentioned Anonymous in the first 50 comments. Looks like Sony's users are starting to blame them for the breach and the downtime.

    • Re: (Score:2, Troll)

      by Runaway1956 (1322357)

      DON'T CLICK THE LINK!! It's nothing more than official Sony brainwashing!

    • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

      by Dachannien (617929)

      Judging from the graphics on their website, the real problem is that somebody poured Coca-Cola in their servers.

  • Alright Sony. Time for you to stop what you're doing and execute plan B. Nuke n' pave your servers and rebuild from the ground up. Then, import user data and purchases from backups. Screw trying to reverse engineer the security damage. You can do that on your own time and a separate test network. Just get those customers up an running ASAP!

    • by gweihir (88907)

      Alright Sony. Time for you to stop what you're doing and execute plan B. Nuke n' pave your servers and rebuild from the ground up. Then, import user data and purchases from backups. Screw trying to reverse engineer the security damage. You can do that on your own time and a separate test network. Just get those customers up an running ASAP!

      Might still take months,...,years. And if they do not do it better this time, they will just get hacked again. It is now known that they are an easy target. I agree that the attack analysis is a red herring. It is however quite possible that is the only thing they can do at the moment, or rather the outside security experts they brought in. Don't forget this is a Japanese company. TEPCO comes to mind.

  • by lennier1 (264730) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @05:57PM (#36066422)

    Translation:
    "Someone changed the passwords to something other than the defaults and we can't get back into the servers again."

  • by Animats (122034) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @05:59PM (#36066442) Homepage

    Sony:

    "We're still working to confirm the security of the network infrastructure, as well as working with a variety of outside entities to confirm with them of the security of the system. Verifying the system security is vital for the process of restoration. Additional comprehensive system checks and testing are still required, and we must complete that process before bringing the systems online."

    To understand this, read VISA International's "What to Do if Compromised. [visa.com].

    "Working with a variety of outside entities to confirm with them of the security of the system." means VISA International and/or MasterCard, Inc have invoked their contractual rights to send in auditors, security experts, and computer forensics experts. They do that for big security breaches. "Additional comprehensive system checks and testing are still required, and we must complete that process before bringing the systems online." means "VISA, etc. won't let us go back on line until we pass their security tests."

    So Sony isn't entirely in control of when they go back on line.

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by cbhacking (979169)

      Damn good thing, too. I have no particular love for the credit card companies, but I trust them to act in their best interest here, which is:
      A) Ensure that people are happy with using their credit cards (which means their data isn't getting stolen, and they aren't needing to replace their cards, and ideally anybody whose card info did get stolen gets it re-issued with a new number and expiration immediately).
      B) Ensure that they aren't going to have to eat a bunch of fraudulent charges (a large batch of frau

      • by BKX (5066)

        Concerning 1.B: Merchants are the ones held responsible in cases of fraud. If you steal a credit card and buy $1000 worth of Wal-Mart shit, then Wal-Mart is out $1000 unless they can figure out who you are and either have you arrested so you can pay restitution or sue the crap out of you. Generally, most companies are forced to pick option C which is: bitch about it, fire someone and do nothing to stop it from happening again.

        That's where your point 1.C comes in. VISA is going to do exactly 1.C by threateni

        • The old saw comes to mind:

          If you owe the bank $100, they are in control. If you owe the bank a few billion, you are in control.

          No way in hell will VISA or MC terminate Sony's merchant contract. When the client is that large, normal rules no longer apply.
    • by debrain (29228)

      So Sony isn't entirely in control of when they go back on line.

      Sir –

      Why not provide the service for free until Sony fixes their payment problem?

  • Perhaps this is just further testing of their hypothesis:

    If you only slightly abuse the consumers, they will dump you for another company that treats them better; However, If you abuse your customers thoroughly enough they will never leave you.

    Instead they'll start making excuses for their abusers: "It's not Sony's fault! They were pwn'd by 1337 haxorz, see they still love me, they promise not to be reckless like that ever again..."

    Ultimately, after being subjected to enough abuse, they begin lying to themselves: "I'm sorry, Sony, please don't raise the prices. You can charge me again, I'm just grateful for the DRM you let me pay for, I'll try not to loose my downloaded data anymore... You're right, I should have backed up my data -- How stupid of me to think you'd let me re-download without paying, It's not like it costs you nothing to retransmit me the file -- I'll pay for a better connection next time."

    "We're sorry for wanting to use the hardware the way we want -- You're right Sony, Hackers ARE bad. I see now that I should loathe Anonymous and Mr. Hotz -- People like that rob me of my PSN, and cause cheating -- It's not like I should expect my player hosted online matches to work without your amazing authentication server to coordinate the connection -- Yes, I'm sorry, I am too untrustworthy to be given the option of entering the IP addresses of our peers, please give me back the central network! I'll behave! I promise!"

  • Has anyone heard what Capcom has to say about people who would like to play their games?
  • by Tei (520358) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @06:05PM (#36066494) Journal

    There has ben some rumours, back and for, discussing about what versions where installed in Sony servers.

    Based on this nmap of the network:
    http://pastebin.com/bAUHxtNr [pastebin.com]

    Nmap scan report for account.rc.ac.playstation.net (199.108.4.177)
    Host is up (0.077s latency).
    Scanned at 2011-04-05 22:53:40 MDT for 428s
    Not shown: 999 filtered ports
    PORT STATE SERVICE VERSION
    443/tcp open ssl/http Apache httpd 2.2.11 ((Unix) mod_ssl/2.2.11 OpenSSL/0.9.8i)

    Nmap scan report for login.rc.ac.playstation.net (199.108.4.162)
    Host is up (0.085s latency).
    Scanned at 2011-04-05 22:53:40 MDT for 428s
    Not shown: 999 filtered ports
    PORT STATE SERVICE VERSION
    443/tcp open ssl/http Apache httpd 2.2.11 ((Unix) mod_ssl/2.2.11 OpenSSL/0.9.

    Nmap scan report for commerce.rc.ac.playstation.net (199.108.4.135)
    Host is up (0.071s latency).
    Scanned at 2011-04-05 22:53:40 MDT for 428s
    Not shown: 998 filtered ports
    PORT STATE SERVICE VERSION
    80/tcp closed http
    443/tcp open ssl/http Apache httpd 2.2.11 ((Unix) mod_ssl/2.2.11 OpenSSL/0.9.8i)

    Nmap scan report for auth.rc.ac.playstation.net (199.108.4.136)
    Host is up (0.075s latency).
    Scanned at 2011-04-05 22:53:40 MDT for 428s
    Not shown: 999 filtered ports
    PORT STATE SERVICE VERSION
    443/tcp open ssl/http Apache httpd 2.2.11 ((Unix) mod_ssl/2.2.11 OpenSSL/0.9.8i)

    Nmap scan report for store.rc.ac.playstation.net (199.108.4.140)
    Host is up (0.070s latency).
    Scanned at 2011-04-05 22:53:40 MDT for 428s
    Not shown: 999 filtered ports
    PORT STATE SERVICE VERSION
    443/tcp open ssl/http Apache httpd 2.2.11 ((Unix) mod_ssl/2.2.11 OpenSSL/0.9.8i)

    Nmap scan report for rc.store.playstation.net (199.108.4.141)
    Host is up (0.080s latency).
    Scanned at 2011-04-05 22:53:40 MDT for 428s
    Not shown: 998 filtered ports
    PORT STATE SERVICE VERSION
    80/tcp open http Apache httpd 2.2.11 ((Unix) mod_ssl/2.2.11 OpenSSL/0.9.8i)
    443/tcp open ssl/http Apache httpd 2.2.11 ((Unix) mod_ssl/2.2.11 OpenSSL/0.9.8i)

    Nmap scan report for native.rc.ac.playstation.net (199.108.4.144)
    Host is up (0.073s latency).
    Scanned at 2011-04-05 22:53:40 MDT for 428s
    Not shown: 999 filtered ports
    PORT STATE SERVICE VERSION
    443/tcp open ssl/http Apache httpd 2.2.11 (mod_ssl/2.2.11 OpenSSL/0.9.8i)

    * login server 2.2.11 (version from 2008)
    * account server 2.2.11 (version from 2008)
    * commerce server 2.2.11 (version from 2008)
    * auth server 2.2.11 (version from 2008)
    * store server 2.2.11 (version from 2008)
    * rc store server 2.2.11 (version from 2008)
    * native server 2.2.11 (version from 2008)

    There are some talking about the server auth.np.ac.playstation.net. That one was updated.

    Nmap scan report for auth.np.ac.playstation.net (199.108.4.73)
    Host is up (0.070s latency).
    Scanned at 2011-04-05 22:53:40 MDT for 428s
    Not shown: 999 filtered ports
    PORT STATE SERVICE VERSION
    443/tcp open ssl/http Apache httpd 2.2.17

    TL:DR
    YES, Sony was using outdated servers. Unpatched? no idea.

  • by Sarusa (104047) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @06:06PM (#36066498)

    Look at what they're doing here:
          - completely rearchitecting their security and network
          - completely reimplementing their security and network
          - physically moving the servers
          - redeploying this worldwide

    Two weeks? I don't f@#4ing think so. They're just stringing you along or they really do have no idea what they're doing (I'll buy either).

    I wouldn't use it for a couple weeks either till they work out the bugs. Me, I've been playing Portal 2 on PC.

    • by lennier (44736) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @06:18PM (#36066568) Homepage

      Look at what they're doing here:

            - completely rearchitecting their security and network

            - completely reimplementing their security and network

            - physically moving the servers

            - redeploying this worldwide

      You forgot:

      * deploying mirrorshades razorgirls to the BAMA Sprawl to hunt the console cowboys who cracked their ICE
      * impersonating the Eastern Seaboard Fission Authority
      * burning Chrome

      I love living in the squalid cyberfuture.

    • by gweihir (88907)

      If they are doing anything at all a this time. It is quite possible they are still trying to grasp what the external security experts have told them. In my opinion that could well have been "You cannot repair this trash. Throw it _all_ away, sack the incompetent idiots responsible for this (and that includes management) and start over. Time: 1-2 years at least."

  • by SniperJoe (1984152) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @06:09PM (#36066524)
    I hate to defend Sony here (it'll probably cost me some karma), but it seems like they're in a "damned if you do and damned if you don't" scenario. A week and a half ago, they disclosed the nature of the personal information breach and everyone seemed to be clamoring about how long it took them to say something. In this case, they release more information during their press conference a few days later, then they discovered that it was a bit worse than they had thought and now everyone is pointing the finger at them because they released information that was incorrect. In a perfect world, we would all be able to release completely accurate information right after the event, but everyone here knows the difficulty in that.
    • I hate to defend Sony here (it'll probably cost me some karma), but it seems like they're in a "damned if you do and damned if you don't" scenario. A week and a half ago, they disclosed the nature of the personal information breach and everyone seemed to be clamoring about how long it took them to say something. In this case, they release more information during their press conference a few days later, then they discovered that it was a bit worse than they had thought and now everyone is pointing the finger at them because they released information that was incorrect. In a perfect world, we would all be able to release completely accurate information right after the event, but everyone here knows the difficulty in that.

      No, Sony's in the typical "damned because they didn't" scenario.

      Damned because they didn't respect consumer rights.
      Damned because they didn't test their system's security.
      Damned because they didn't realize that taunting hackers was a bad idea.
      Damned because they built a shitty network and stored unencrypted credit card data (if at this point you still believe their bullshit about it being encrypted, you're the dippest of shits). Several friends have been hit with fraudulent charges in the last few weeks, a

  • My guess: The external IT security experts they have had to contract are refusing to sign off on the "repaired" system, because it is just far too broken. Maybe it cannot be repaired at all, which would mean either a few more months of outage or a good likelihood of getting hacked again in a short time.

  • Will Sony keep delaying the reactivation? :P

  • Rather than Slashdot linking to some site called "I4U" which links to Joystiq, which links to the article on Sony's playstation site, how about we just fucking link to the Sony article and do away with the blog self-promotion chain?

    http://blog.us.playstation.com/2011/05/06/service-restoration-update/ [playstation.com]

  • by msauve (701917) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @07:14PM (#36066984)
    SO, Not Yet.
  • Fuck the PSN, and fuck Sony. Fuck Xbox Live and Microsoft as well. When these cunts announce their new consoles, I'm going to ignore them (and Nintendo as well), build a PC, and ignore consoles. I've had enough of this shit. If Valve can't keep Steam's data locked down, then I'll just download bootleg games.
  • I just got a PSP go thinking it would be perfect to compliment my kindle for an upcoming international flight. But I can't even play the games that came with it since the game installer disk needs to authenticate with the PSN to install the games.

    I have been considering shipping it and the bonus game disk back for service, maybe they can load the games for me.

  • by future assassin (639396) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @09:21PM (#36067752) Homepage

    Does anyone have any news if Sony will get any punishment for this from VISA/MS/Gov? I'm really interested who this works out regarding PCI/PA-DSS. Seems Sony should have gotten a whoops for this

    If we don't see any harsh punishment for breaking PCI-DSS then the whole certification process/requirements are a farce and don't apply to big corporations.

  • by anlprb (130123) on Sunday May 08, 2011 @11:57PM (#36068530)

    I happened to use the same ID/PW on both my PSN and my LOTRO account. Three months ago, someone had the ID to the LOTRO account and sold all my stuff. Long story short, Sony has NO F'ING CLUE how long they were being exploited. I never logged in anywhere other than personal machines to LOTRO, so there is NO WAY it could have been stolen from anywhere else. They were broken into over three months ago and they never knew it. They only just found out because some silly kid who had access decided to put a file on their servers that they FINALLY SAW. This honestly is pathetic. I have no faith in Sony anymore. They lost me and everyone I advise in a technical capacity. They will never know how many people that is, but I will. Standard response now is. Go with Xbox for games, Western Digital streaming device for Netflix, and a stand alone blue ray player if needed. At least Microsoft knows it is a target and has some semblance of a clue for NOT putting all of their proverbial eggs in one basket. I don't even know how to express the anger that I have for something that I thought would be safe and turned out to have them just having completely no clue on. For a major corporation, this is pathetic. There is no going back from this. Everyone in my family and everyone who I consult at work and personally will be told what happened and how long it has happened. I have already had people say "I thought Sony was a good company." Well, they weren't. To them, this is PR, to me, this is my personal information and my time spent in a game. Wasted, because of their hubris. Thanks Sony. You just lost me, my family and everyone whose ear I can bend. You won't care, but I do.

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