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Security Software Linux

Ubuntu Servers Hacked 330

An anonymous reader noted that "Ubuntu had to shutdown 5 of 8 production servers that are sponsored by Canonical, when they started attacking other systems. Canonical blames the community, saying they were community hosted, and were poorly maintained. However, kernel upgrades couldn't be done because of poor backwards compatibility with the very hardware that Canonical had sponsored! While people point fingers at each other it is pretty clear that both sides are equally to blame, the community administrators for practicing bad security practices, such as using unencrypted FTP transfers with accounts, not properly maintaining the system. However Canonical should have been well aware of what they are hosting. The question remains, if any of the files distributed to users have been compromised. A major blow for Canonical though who are attempting to enter the business market with Ubuntu Server."
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Ubuntu Servers Hacked

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  • sorry... (Score:2, Insightful)

    by cosmocain ( 1060326 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @10:46AM (#20236613)
    administrators, but:

    who the hell places such exposed servers like these on the net without applying security patches and following simple rules? yeah, the freaking old hardware, compab problems, i sure understand that. but then make a fuss 'bout it. threat to stop maintaining the hardware if the networks cards aren't changed. if that REALLY is the only problem with the hardware which prevented updates, then i just don't understand how the hell this could happen. NICs, even though this would be no consumer hardware, aren't that expensive. if my employees servers were hacked because i did not mind telling him that some crappy piece of hardware prevented me from keeping uptodate with security, i would kindly be removed from my desk. period.
  • sftp (Score:4, Insightful)

    by SolusSD ( 680489 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @10:48AM (#20236639) Homepage
    it amazes me that people even use the plain old ftp protocol for anything important. sftp has been around forever.
  • how ironic (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @10:52AM (#20236681)
    had these been windows servers we would have heard cries of a flaky operating system being the problem. in this case, since they're linux servers, we hear that the fault lays on the administrators of the boxen for not hardening the systems?
  • Re:sorry... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by ZachPruckowski ( 918562 ) <zachary.pruckowski@gmail.com> on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @10:56AM (#20236749)
    Oh, from the sounds of it, all that you say is well-warranted. They were running a version of Ubuntu from October of 2005, which was obsoleted in April of this year, and they weren't using encryption. This is security 101, and they didn't do it. This does sound a lot more like an administration problem than a software problem.

    Ultimately, I'd say that if this does wind up being an admin problem, then Ubuntu Server will not suffer. The bottom line is that a poorly administered server is a hacker target regardless of the OS.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @11:05AM (#20236885)
    It has nothing to do with dumbing it down for Windows users making it insecure, although I admit, this case is again a demonstration that the bigest secuirty hole on a computer is the lump of carbon/hydrogen/oxygen located between the keyboard and the chair.

    They got arrogant, cocky and lazy. They let their security slip on things a Windows uers wouldn't use or care about (ex. FTP vs SFTP, from a user perspective, the difference is minimal).

    Does your reality distortion field go so far as to say that Windows is causing functional breakage in Linux now? Geeze. Lemme guess, you are gonna add global warming, wars, AIDS, ebola and the common cold to the list as well, right?

    Heck, fairly certain that ftp wasn't active by default on my last install of Ubuntu (I know SFTP was though).

    FTP vs SFTP - maintainer arogance/incompetance
    Kernel couldn't be upgraded given the hardware supplied by Ubuntu's owning company - the companies own problems

  • by abigor ( 540274 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @11:23AM (#20237153)
    Okay, so your assertion of fact was really just an enormous assumption. Thanks for the clarification.
  • by Frosty Piss ( 770223 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @11:24AM (#20237177)

    I don't think documenting the discovery process is going to do anyone any favors.

    Isn't that part of the Linux/Microsoft Double Standard? Now, if Microsoft this type of issue and had been less than totally open about the cause and methods, you know as well as I do that there would be a high-pitched wailing from the Slashdot World.

  • by greedyturtle ( 968401 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @11:24AM (#20237185)
    It's a lot harder to remotely install a PCI card than it is to complain about it on an internet message board.
  • Re:how ironic (Score:2, Insightful)

    by deftcoder ( 1090261 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @11:35AM (#20237367)
    That's because with Linux, you actually *CAN* harden your system. (e.g. kernel-level security patches, exec-shield, SELinux, etc.)
  • You made a good argument, but when you use terms like "Windoze" you lose credibility.
  • Re:sftp (Score:5, Insightful)

    by burner ( 8666 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @12:00PM (#20237653) Homepage Journal
    rsync works great for many use cases when transfers really need to be resumed.
  • by AndyCR ( 1091663 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @12:09PM (#20237757) Homepage
    Thousands of Windows machines get exploited every day, and there's barely a word said about it. 3 Linux machines are exploited, and it's "OH MY GOSH!!111". I don't know whether this is a good thing, a bad thing, or, my best guess, both.
  • Re:Idiot (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Egdiroh ( 1086111 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @12:11PM (#20237791)

    Yes, it means exactly what he thinks it means. This whole thing with calling hackers "security researchers" is just silly beyond belief. Both of these little peccadilloes in terminology are reasons that no one who really counts takes the Slashsnot crowd very seriously.


    I don't think you know what he thinks it really means. I think he want's to use hacking as a generic term, for doing stuff as in "I hacked together a working PC form all the junk in my basement" or "I hacked that new feature into my existing code.", and so the poster and many people who like using the word hacker for themselves but don't want others to immediately associate themselves with criminal hackers, tried to coin a new term for those people, "crackers". And while that term never caught on people who want you to call criminal hackers crackers, will always make issue of calling them hackers in the hope that one day they might call themselves hackers, with out any of the negative connotations.

    Interestingly enough many people who take that position try to use defend their strictly non-criminal activity use of the word by citing the famous MIT non computer hacks. The irony of this of course is that many of those involved minor criminal activity like breaking and entering.
  • by SgtChaireBourne ( 457691 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @12:12PM (#20237813) Homepage

    You can back up your policy in the packet filter.

    In iptables, look up osf and --genre.

    For pf, look up osfp.

  • Re:Hacked... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Lord Ender ( 156273 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @12:27PM (#20238003) Homepage
    Language changes with time. This particular word has changed meanings (or at least got a new meaning) in the English language. You don't have to like that fact, but bitching on slashdot isn't going to change that fact.

    People in the industry are aware that "hack" used to mean "cleverly manipulate a device into doing something its designers did not intend." People also know that "wherefor" used to mean "why." In both cases, the original definitions no longer apply.

    Language changes. You'll get over it. There are more important battles to fight.
  • How right you are! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by spun ( 1352 ) <loverevolutionary@@@yahoo...com> on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @12:51PM (#20238291) Journal
    I've never seen a paid individual make a stupid mistake like this. The captain of the Exxon Valdez was a volunteer with the Red Cross on a humanitarian mission. The Challenger and Columbia were piloted by kids from space camp. The original Tacoma Narrows bridge was designed by volunteers with Habitat for Humanity.

    On the other hand, we all know that segregation & apartheid were both ended by paid professionals. If you want something big done right, only paid professionals can do it.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @01:00PM (#20238403)
    What you are is a paranoid narcissist who is too immature to hold a rational discussion.

    Here we are, talking about a serious security breach at a prominent Linux distributor, and all you can muster is a hissy fit because not enough people are blaming Microsoft for it.

    It's not clever. It's certainly not constructive. Worst of all, it reflects poorly on the community you claim to serve.

    You're the rhetorical equivalent of a brick-throwing protester at a WTO meeting, foolishly believing that vandalism and insulting slogans will right the injustices of the world, while earning nothing but contempt from the very people you're trying to convert to your cause. Luckily for you, the "riot police" on Slashdot are only armed with Troll and Flamebait mods.
  • by _Sprocket_ ( 42527 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @01:17PM (#20238621)

    Isn't that part of the Linux/Microsoft Double Standard? Now, if Microsoft this type of issue and had been less than totally open about the cause and methods, you know as well as I do that there would be a high-pitched wailing from the Slashdot World.
    I'm not so sure this is any kind of double standard. The last time Microsoft was compromised there wasn't a "high-pitched wailing from the Slashdot World" demanding details. Nobody really expected to hear any details. And we didn't get any. I'm sure there were some who would have been interested in them... and others who didn't care. And this is the situation we're in now.

    Some people care about these details and some don't. The parent apparently thinks there's nothing to learn. I disagree. There might be something really interesting in this case. But even if its just a comedy of errors or highlights issues we've known about for years, there is still value. It serves as a reminder for why we take the additional effort to do things "right."

    And so... typical to Slashdot and other public forums... I voice disagreement with the parent poster. It seems we don't have a single voice on the issue. Sorry if that disrupts your concept of Slashdot.
  • by mickwd ( 196449 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @01:52PM (#20239069)
    "The funniest one is still one where one of my coworkers nuked /lib on a fairly important machine unintentionally"

    "He never got a root password for an important server after that incident. In hindsight, that was a funny incident, and a valuable lesson to us all (we all became paranoid of rereading what we just typed)."

    I hope the decision to deny him root access was based on more than that one unintentional incident. It could have happened to any of you. After all, why else would it be a "valuable lesson" to you ? Isn't the person who made that mistake the least likely to make it again ? And you did also say you "could fill about a 100 pages on my own from stupid things I've done".
  • by nuzak ( 959558 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @02:04PM (#20239231) Journal
    > you know as well as I do that there would be a high-pitched wailing from the Slashdot World.

    You mean the high-pitched wailing from the Slashdot World actually stops at some point?
  • Re:Hacked... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Lord Ender ( 156273 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @02:05PM (#20239241) Homepage
    No. I'm saying that today, "hack" ACTUALLY MEANS "to bypass digital security." Insisting we use the older definition of the word because we are not "common idiots" is analogous to an English teachers' website requiring all posts be made in Olde English. Or worse, Middle English. I don't see you advocating we all write like Chaucer so that we can differentiate ourselves from "common idiots."
  • Re:Hacked... (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @02:12PM (#20239333)
    Huh? who uses "wherefore" to mean something other than archaic 'why'? you can't claim linguistic shift just because stupid people tend to misuse a particular word.
  • Re:Idiot (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Marty_Krapturd ( 817250 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @02:47PM (#20239843) Homepage

    An individual or a group can try to make a term mean one thing or another thing, however until popular support for that definition is accepted it's still just wishful thinking.

    As long as I can recall, in the world of computers and main stream media, a "hacker" is a person attempting to circumvent security measures for nefarious purposes (i.e. a Black Hat). Does this mean that you can't tilt at windmills? No. Just keep in mind that you may never win that battle. Can't hurt for trying, though, right? I mean, it's not like anyone is being arrested for being a "hacker" or anything. Oh...wait...

  • by bealzabobs_youruncle ( 971430 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @02:48PM (#20239861)
    See, this is what I'm talking about, you automatically go on defensive if anyone has any honest criticism of Ubuntu. I think I stated some of my issues pretty clearly, but Ubuntu supporters now have thinner skin than Apple users in the 90s. I'm a huge fan of a simple and clean Gnome interface, but I'm against trying to bury the CLI and refusing to learn how to do things properly. I'm against mindlessly installing stuff via Automatix (especially close source and binary blobs) without honestly understanding what you are doing and what the implications are (note several Ubuntu devs agree with this point).

    Again, I am pointing at the community more than the developers, who have provided a great distro that has provided a much needed kick in the pants to other distros to improve their usability. Fedora is my favorite example, and my distro of choice again, since they had to face some stiff competition to stay relevant.

    Ubuntu was about a clean interface with best of breed apps, solid documentation and a community that balanced ease of use with best practices. When someone wandered into the forums with a "noob" question we avoided the "RTFM newb-sauce" stuff and helped them, as well as re-enforcing best practices and linking where to get better information. We didn't point them to untested scripts or recommend subverting security for ease of use, but that is a regular event these days. Shuttleworth wanted "free as in speech" software that was "free as in beer" for everyone, but now to court Windows users he considers installing binary blobs and distributing closed source software? The "Unofficial Ubuntu FAQ" used to handle this stuff very well while not polluting (or introducing possible legal issues) to the distro. I recall Shuttleworth at Debian conferences with his hat in his hand explaining how he wants to help and work with the community, but if you mention this on the Ubuntu forums you have people suggesting that they don't need Debian or the GNU tools? This is an ignorant and arrogant user base that needs to be educated, and in some instances policed.

    The original intent of Ubuntu was great, it just needs to get back on course. I much prefer apt to yum, I hope this wakes up the right people and I will gladly give Ubuntu a shot again.

  • Re:BWAHAHAHA... (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Klaidas ( 981300 ) on Wednesday August 15, 2007 @03:36PM (#20240451)
    Uh-oh, he's emphasizing the irony of this, and the irony is towards linux!!! FLAMEBAIT, TROLL, OVERRATED, quick, mod him down untill someone sees it!!!
    /MAJOR SARCASM

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