Faulty Microsoft Driver Saps Intel Core Duo power 268
Critical_ writes "Tom's Hardware recently discovered a bug in Microsoft's ACPI driver implementation under Windows XP SP2 that causes a loss of more than one hour of battery time when connecting any USB 2.0 device to an Intel Core Duo based system. Apparently Microsoft, Intel and ODMs have known of this problem under a confidentiality agreement since July 12, 2005 via (a still private) Knowledge Base article KB899179. The bug lies in the asynchronous scheduler component inadvertently being left running causing Windows' internal task scheduler (ITS) to treat it as a running process involving the attached device. This in turn prevents the ITS from powering down the processor into one of the ACPI sleep states causing the system to use more battery power. At this time there seems to be no fix. Strangely, single-core systems and AMD systems are not affected. This leads one to wonder if it is truely a software problem or if there a much larger hardware problem that may affect Core Duo equipped Apple systems."
And thanks to the confidiality agreement (Score:4, Insightful)
Seems best to stay away from both companies.
Why can't they just be honest and say "this is the problem and this is what we're doing about it"
Why? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Why? (Score:2, Insightful)
Submitter didn't RFTA (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Why? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Why? (Score:3, Insightful)
That, and who around here cares about problems that effect only XP ?
Comon.. (Score:5, Insightful)
So once again we have a chance to bash Intel, perfect!
Did you ever stop to consider that maybe that specific state, which cannot be reached, is only utilized by the Core Duo? Maybe if AMD had a laptop dual core chip we'd see the same behavior.. But hey, if we can make Intel look bad because of a Microsoft bug, then we are two for two!
This is great news. (Score:1, Insightful)
Who wants to bet their next marketing campaign is going to take advantage of this deficiency in Windows, like they did when W95 came out?
Re:AMD Looking Good (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:confidentiality agreement (Score:5, Insightful)
What about linux? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:And thanks to the confidiality agreement (Score:5, Insightful)
Why can't they just be honest and say "this is the problem and this is what we're doing about it"
Because they don't want people to know there is a problem, and that they're not doing anything about it, maybe?
Re:Why? (Score:5, Insightful)
My bet the problem is in BIOS, and not EFI. Since this affects only XP computers and those require bios to function. BIOS with ACPI has always been a poor hack. Windows Computers have always had a hard time returning from sleep with 100% accuracy. Maybe it wasn't windows fault but the bios underneath.
Wait did I just say it wasn't windows fault? damn I have got to get some sleep.
Apple using sockets? (Score:3, Insightful)
So if I have to send my new macbook (delivery 15th Feb haha believe it when I see it) back for a newer faster processor sometime down the track I won't lose any sleep over it.
Re:confidentiality agreement (Score:5, Insightful)
How does the shorter battery life make this defective? If the company had sold this as having a much longer battery life then failed to live up to it then that would be a problem. Just because the software (or hardware bug) isn't shutting down a processor doesn't make this a legal issue.
Re:Submitter didn't RFTA (Score:3, Insightful)
YEAAAAHHHHHH... (Score:5, Insightful)
P.S. Linux doesn't really count in this manner because it gets ignored as a "geek OS" and not really something anybody can run.
Re:Yawn, non free sucks. (Score:5, Insightful)
I never concluded Apple had a problem. Rather I suggest it could be a problem because Microsoft's ACPI driver communicates with the ICH7-M Southbridge. If I am not mistaken, Apple uses the same southbridge on it's hardware. As the article repeatedly states, this issue can be anywhere on the chain from the southbridge, the Microsoft driver or even the attach peripheral. If it's purely a driver problem then why has it taken Microsoft and Intel 6 months of a non-working fix? Why are single core systems not affected by the same driver? Could this issue affect Linux or Mac OSX users on those platforms? Sure it could be a state-based issue but no one can really know until further testing takes place and Intel/Microsoft release more details.
heh (Score:2, Insightful)
full disclosure of bugs (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm not sure you can label the product as "defective". Software is too complicated to be labelled "defective" just becuase it has bugs. Moreover, I'm not sure you could legally require Microsoft to reveal every bug they know about, especially since the software you bought carried a prominent notice in the EULA saying, roughly "This software is not guaranteed to work; if it fails to function in some way it's not our problem -- you shouldn't have relied on it in the first place". They never promised the ACPI driver will actually work. Note that the GPL carries a similar clause.
That said, I'd rather rely on free software to function as advertized. When the big pieces fail (kernel, web broswer, ...) fixes are usually quick since many experts are working transparently. When small pieces fail (my favorite editor) I can fix them myself and submit a patch.
The other solution, of course, is to pay for warranty. The problem is that no-one is willing to guarantee Windows will work, and that includes the hardware OEM -- I'm sure the people who make the laptop will say that they can't warranty someone else's OS.
Re:Not Intel bashing at all. (Score:3, Insightful)
I think the problem might be that you don't have much experience when it comes to real-world systems. We're not talking about some college student writing an English report. Often times there are situations where executives are making presentations to potential clients for contracts worth tens of millions of dollars. It could be financially dangerous for such a company if a laptop that's supposed to give them 5 hours of life unexpectedly only gives 4 hours, especially while sending important emails or while doing a presentation.
The minor savings in terms of reduced power usage would never make up for a lost $45 million contract.
Re:full disclosure of bugs (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:full disclosure of bugs (Score:2, Insightful)
And yes, the GPL has a similar clause to the MS EULA, but with the GPL and my OS (Debian) I can be sure that the Debian devs don't withhold information about bugs affecting me (bugs.debian.org and Debain Social Contract clause 3).
The problem here is not that bugs in a driver/CPU combo exist. There are many of those: recently there was a bug with AMD dualcores and Cool'n'Quiet under Windows and Linux. There was no fix but it was disclosed. The problem here is that neither MS nor Intel told us about it, and for this they should get their well deserved bad press and a boot to the head
Re:full disclosure of bugs (Score:3, Insightful)
Just about everything is "too complicated" to be labeled "defective" if you're going to take that approach.
But "defective" is simply as defective does.
If your car engine tears itself apart after 10k miles because a piston was made out of tolerance that is a defect because the part is a piston, not due any actual property of the object itself. It's role is to play a part in a system, and it is the system that defines the defect.
Perhaps you are laboring under the misapprehension that that warranty guaruntees function. This is obvious nonsense as just about everything can only be guarunteed to not function under certain circumstances. Perfection does not exist if only because perfection is defined by the environment.
A warranty simply states that the producing takes responsibility for certain failures.
KFG
Re:Why? (Score:3, Insightful)
WTF? (Score:2, Insightful)
I dual boot between Windows XP Pro SP2 for gaming and Windows XP Pro x64 for work, and both work absolutely perfectly.
and this:
I have been running this system since November with only one or two reboots.
does not compute.
Who would have thought? (Score:1, Insightful)