Symantec Hit by Product Activation Glitch 277
An anonymous reader writes "According to this article, Symantec has hit a snag in their product activation scheme. On a certain machine, the software machine would always ask for the activation when the computer is started or restarted, despite the fact that they have thoroughly tested the scheme." According to the article, Symantec has finally managed to replicate the problem, and those hit by the bug are asked to contact Symantec's support channels. However, there's no mention of a fix yet.
Re:Time to move (Score:1, Interesting)
Doesn't have virus problems? Whatever.
How Do They Not Get It? (Score:4, Interesting)
Is this just another case of managerial idiocy--the programmer grunts can't explain to the bosses that it is a futile misguided effort?
Or are the programmers just not really trying? Are they just going along with it because it's their job, rather than actually trying to make a quality product? (which, as it turns out, really isn't their job)
Re:Honest users the victims (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:How Do They Not Get It? (Score:4, Interesting)
"This really has been a top priority for our product activation development team."
They have a 'product activation developement team.' So, there's one group of people working on this, and that's their job. the people with other jobs aren't in the loop about product activation, and those working on it need it for job security.
I can't really see many people saying, "Excuse me, sir, my job doesn't matter."
I wonder if they actually decided to implement product activation without asking the programmers? It seems insane, and there's no way to know, but anything is possible.
My product activation strory. (Score:4, Interesting)
I had to reinstall one of the machines in the Web Cafe that I own. Since all the computers have the exact same hardware, the easiest way was to pull the hard drive from one of the PCs to the one that is acting as a file and print server.
Because of several reasons that I really don't want to explain right now, all the machines are running Windows XP Pro (yes, I did try using Linux first, no, the clients didn't want to use it.)
So I have all my licenses in order ( the BSA can come here and kiss my ass) and activated.
I swapped the hard drives, and of course, I knew I would had to activate Windows again. No problem right?
yeah, right
A message came up saying that I had exceeded the number of installations valid for my CD Key or something like that.
"Crap, now what? I paid for All these licenses!"
So I called the 1-800 number on the screen and tried to navigate the voice menu (I hate those). The system hanged on me twice before I could speak to a real person.
"What seems to be the problem"
I described to her the problem and I had to dictate her a 30 digit number that was on screen. After a while, she gave me another 30 digit number to type.
After we were finished I asked her If I would have to call every single time I needed to reinstall Windows. She said that she didn't knew.
If I have to call Microsoft every single time I need to reinstall MY machines, I am going to be very, very pissed.
With product activation, Microsoft is treating their customers, me in this case, like criminals. I could have downloaded a crack from the Net, but no, instead I spend 10,000 pesos (almost 1,000 dollars) in Microsoft software and I get treated like a criminal and waste my time calling them for permission to reinstall my machines.
This sucks.
As soon as I think my clients could start using a Linux desktop just by sitting in front of it and not needing any training, all Microsoft software is out from here.
Product activation sucks. The people who want to use software illegaly with product activation will find a way (cracks, serials, etc) and the only ones getting the finger are the honest paying costumers.
Microsoft's Product Activation (Score:5, Interesting)
My company standardised on Office 2000 at a cost of > $300 per seat (10 seats). The original activation was sooo easy; we have an "always-on" Internet connection, the software connected to Microsoft's site and we were off to the races in about 30 seconds after installing.
As computers will do, several went belly up and I had to replace them. One needed nothing more than a bigger hard disk, but required re-authorization. In the meantime (less than 6 mos), MS had released Office XP. Wouldn't you know that activation was no longer so easy! The software kept coming up with "server not responding" and I was forced to call to get an authorization code. This activity included an extra copy that we bought that had never been activated! So much for their promises of being easy to authorize.
After a couple of 20 minute (mostly on hold) sessions to get authorization numbers, I tracked down a cracked copy of Office. I still keep the original licenses in a locked cabinet in case we are ever audited by the software gestapo, but I re-install off of the cracked copy to avoid the authorization. I personally think this is a forced upgrade policy.
We can no longer buy Office 2000. What do you think I'm going to do when we need a new copy of Office? Microsoft has forced me to pirate their software!
(posted as AC for obvious reasons)
Re:Honest users the victims (Score:2, Interesting)
This is particularly bad in this type product (Score:5, Interesting)
Symantec should realize their market, and for those who paid, expect to be able to use their product.
Luckily they don't have this yet on the macintosh side...
Re:Oh for the love of god (Score:2, Interesting)
Ditch them. Support their efforts by avoiding them by any means necessary until they start making good software or dry up and die, whichever comes first.
Symantec is nothing compared to the d day.. the day microsoft releases that longhorn bull crap. I bet that'll piss off the rest of the people who were thinking about whether to ditch xp or not.
Software activation is AWESOME. At least for us, "teh open-sore hax0rs" of evil openness.
Re:Hello, McAfee! (Score:3, Interesting)
This is particularly irksome with products like Powerquest's Partition Magic. I mean really, how often does someone need to change the partitioning on a hard drive? I only find a need about once every few months on any given computer. PQ is outta their minds if they think people are going to buy a second copy of PM when they already have one doing nothing on another system.
Re:Oh for the love of god (Score:3, Interesting)
No, it is comfortable, highly-paid executives trying to force oldthink onto a new problem. Product activation is destined to fail simply because it punishes the legitimate user.
I chose W2K a year ago rather than the fancier and "newer" XP for exactly this reason (me not being bright enough/have the time to run Linux), since I add hardware to my machine fairly often and didn't want the additional hassle.
Dear Symantec, (Score:4, Interesting)
Some of the 1.2 million customers that have installed software maker Symantec's latest Norton PC security package have been unable to use the software because of new antipiracy technology, the company confirmed Thursday.
Ok, so 1.2mil is decent install base.
But...
"We thoroughly tested the technology," Smith said. "We ran extensive tests worldwide. You had well over 250,000 customers complete activation, and we didn't have any complaints about this."
So, 1/5'th of your install base did ok, and the rest did not?
Ok, yes I've taken this out of context, but even a second reading *still* seems to imply that 4 out of 5 dentist^H^H^H^H^H^H customers think product activation sucks.
Re:When will they learn?! (Score:5, Interesting)
I tried using a complicated scheme where the registration codes would expire after a period of time and the license key was written to the user's hard drive (along with a MAC address to prevent that file from being copied.) It took the pirates about 2 months longer to crack the scheme, but other than that, it had no effect other than to piss off customers.
Of course I dumped that scheme and went back to a simpler name/code written to a preference file.
But, at the same time, I've introduced a few "anomalies" that pop up only when a pirated serial number is used. This, in turn, causes the casual pirate to send me an e-mail saying "feature x isn't working". And then I politely explain why. I've actually gotten a few new customers because of this technique -- a twist on the "support" theme of the parent post.
And it's fun to watch the confusion caused by the "anomalies" on the cracker discussion forums
Re:Honest users the victims (Score:3, Interesting)
Wrong. I have prooved to myself so many times how very worth it it is to have activation in my product. Unless you don't have an internet connection, mine never has any troubles. I don't know why symantec couldn't manage to make something that just works like mine. Simple public key/private key encryption and a single registry setting and a single hit to a website to encrypt your computer specifics.
Almost nobody even realizes my program uses activation unless they don't have an internet connection and have to do it by email and a little copy and paste. Several times I have seen schools purchase 1 copy and try to activate on a whole lab of computers. Didn't work and most ended up purchasing 20 or 30 copies later on. Somebody uses a stolen credit card and posts the activation code on some chinese website. Over 1000 attempts at activation with that single code within only a few days, but only the first 3 were lucky enough to get it for free because then I disabled the code forever.
And if I ever decide to stop selling and supporting my product, I will compile a freeware version and let the community decide where to host it so nobody ever has to worry about not being able to use what they bought. Not that I plan to stop being self employed, its really a lot of fun.
Re:This is particularly bad in this type product (Score:1, Interesting)
and volume managers:
Last year we had a Sun box go nuts and decided to switch the internal drives and storage array over to a duplicate machine while the tech debugged the hardware on the bad box. Would it work? Of course not. Veritas' volume manager has a licence algorithm geared to the MAC address of the box. Great! Thanks Veritas!
The Sun tech got it going by swapping the firmware chip from one box to the other but you shouldn't have to go digging around in the guts of the computer to do something like this in an emergency.
my experience (Score:5, Interesting)
1. Called 1-800-745-6055. They said to call the download dept. at 1-866-285-6460
2. Called the download department. Their menu didn't sound anything like a download dept. After calling several times and figuring out the number to press to talk to a live human, I was told to call their subscription key dept. at 1-800-441-7234.
3. Called the subscription key department. Had to again figure out how to talk to a human. Finally I did and they forwarded me to an "activation support specialist".
4. Specialist tells me to call the download dept. as specialist only has access to physical CD keys, not the downloaded keys.
5. Called the Download Department. They told me to call the subscription key department. I told them I already did and I'm getting sick of the run around. They put me on hold. Finally said there is no way they can reset my key but they will either ship me a new CD out or let me download a new copy. They tell me it will take 10 days.
I have not received the new CD yet but I did get an email saying it was shipped out. So we will see if this fixes the problem.
Re:When will they learn?! (Score:5, Interesting)
The first few programs I released I simply had a "reminder" window pop up regularly to tell the user that it was a shareware program and that they should make a donation to support the development. One of these programs became relatively popular in a niche market, and I know for a fact that over 250 users are using it daily in BUSINESS production. Guess how many people registered? One. Guess how many people email for support, and get pissed off after I only answer their first 2-3 emails? LOTS.
So, my new programs have an activation feature tied to the program after a 30-day trial. Sure, there's tons of pissed off people that get annoyed when the 30-day trial expires and they have to register to continue using it in their business. Do I care? No, because otherwise they wouldn't register and I would have $0 to show for my thousands of hours of work on the software.
Now for commercial software where they pay money up front, that's a different issue. For shareware, it's the ONLY way to get compensated for the value you're giving people. I find the 30-day trial period lets them decide if its worth the money. If they get caught on day 30 in a pickle, that's their problem because I've warned them for 29 days that it would expire if they didn't register.
MadCow.
Re:Honest users the victims (Score:3, Interesting)
Well there is a notice that says you must be online in order to activate, on the screen where the user must enter their code, but no personal information is really sent with the activation request anyways, its already stored on my server in a database from when they purchased, since you can only purchase and download my program online.
Re:When will they learn? (My rant) (Score:4, Interesting)
Friend, I sympathize, I really do. If the world didn't have serial numbers and passwords, I would be out of a job. I'm even a Mac pro, too. But, all that said, there's no way that I would use warez serial numbers anywhere that I was getting paid to do work. I'll sometimes take that chance on my own machines, when I'm demoing something--I'm not going to purchase a full version of Quark, say, just so I can learn how it operates, so I can learn how to support it. But at work--no way.
If Quark wants to waste your time, pass on the cost to the client. When they challenge a 1/2hr charge, you can explain to them that that was for the 1/2hr you spent on the phone with Quark Volume Licensing--and, oh, btw, Adobe picks up their phone right away, so now do you see how ID would actually save you money? Passing on the costs of Product Activation is the only way to get these corps to change their practices and remember on which side their bread is buttered; enabling that customer-hostility is only going to wind up costing you grief.