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MediaDefender Explains Itself
Posted by
kdawson
on Sun Jun 01, 2008 03:35 PM
from the smurfs-for-hire dept.
from the smurfs-for-hire dept.
I Don't Believe in Imaginary Property writes "Wired has an interview with MediaDefender in which they try to explain why they attacked Revision3, which uses BitTorrent to host its own content. Somehow it eluded MediaDefender that they had injected fake content into Revision3's tracker, so when Revision3 changed configuration to forbid this injection, MediaDefender's systems saw it as a pirate tracker with lots of illegal content (which MediaDefender had put there) and attacked. In other words, everything they did was intentional except for the choice of target. Given that they have 9 Gbps of bandwidth dedicated to denial-of-service attacks against torrent trackers, all anyone needs to do is to trick them into attacking a hospital or government facility. MediaDefender has never been very competent, after all."
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Submission: MediaDefender Explains Itself by Anonymous Coward
[+]
News: MediaDefender's Parent Company Joins P2P Market 40 comments
An anonymous reader writes with news that ArtistDirect, the company who acquired MediaDefender, has launched another company called PiCast for the purpose of P2P video distribution. The reader says:
"This is a strange twist for a company which last year set up a video-sharing site called Miivi in an attempt to entrap users uploading copyrighted content, and was caught launching a DoS attack against Revision3, which we discussed earlier this year."
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Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Insightful)
Unauthorized access and Denial of Service attack.
I'm not quite sure of the details though, were they using a bug to plant the torrents or was the tracker just negligently configured?
The above matters for whether they were hacking(non-geek) or simply using it without authorization.
anyway, "bad boy!" to MediaDefender, surprise surprise.
But will the shit stick all the way to those truly responsible?
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I CONFESS!! IM GUILTY! Can I get off the hook now? (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:I CONFESS!! IM GUILTY! Can I get off the hook n (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:I CONFESS!! IM GUILTY! Can I get off the hook n (Score:5, Interesting)
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Re:I CONFESS!! IM GUILTY! Can I get off the hook n (Score:5, Insightful)
Because they have gotten away with it for near a decade, even though many have pointed out the illegality of it.
And they expect, once again, to get away with it.
And because, this will become even more fuel for them (and the **AA) towards pushing making P2P software entirely illegal, regardless of it's use. Does this last section make sense? No? So what? Do you really think it has to? Look at their other arguments for making P2P illegal - do they make sense? Didnt think so. ;-)
And of course, because it will help them push forward the pending legislation that would make their actions (whatever they are) legal - irrespective of current law.
So... I think it makes perfect sense - at least from their twisted viewpoint.
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Re:I CONFESS!! IM GUILTY! Can I get off the hook n (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:Why would a Wookie live on Endor? (Score:5, Funny)
You can see here, the Router orbiting the forest moon of Endor. Although the download systems on this Router are not yet operational, the Router does have a strong defense mechanism. It is protected by a firewall which is generated from the nearby forest moon of Endor.
The firewall must be deactivated, if any torrent is to be downloaded.
Once the firewall is down, our servers will create a tracker, while our admins hack into the system and attempt to inject the fake contact.
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Re:I CONFESS!! IM GUILTY! Can I get off the hook n (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Informative)
Take down letters, ISP turning your account off due to court order, sure.. But an intentional DoS? WTF?
Since when does 2 illegal acts cancel each other out ( not to mention no illegal act was being committed by Revision3 anyway )?
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Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Informative)
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Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Insightful)
And then there's the part where they openly admit to using DoS attacks against trackers. That part is really brilliant. I'd like to see what law they're looking at where that's a "grey area".
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Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Insightful)
What do we have here ? We have evidence, a confession, and implicit admission of guilt (their system is designed to blast servers). What are we waiting for ? Jesus ain't coming back, so we're going to have to purge these bastards ourselves.
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Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Informative)
They wouldn't host arbitrary torrents, only track them.
They saw it was being used by other people so they disabled that.
You know the rest.
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Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Interesting)
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Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Informative)
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Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Informative)
In a criminal case, the "victim" is not the individual, but rather society as a whole. The State brings the charges, because the state is the "victim." That's why the individual doesn't get to decide whether or not charges are filed, or have the final say in punishment. The individual victim's recourse is to file a civil suit.
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Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Insightful)
There are actually serious laws against this. If you or I did this, we'd spend quite some time in jail, and have to pay quite a large amount in fines. The criminal and civil penalties are not small. Not to mention the probability of losing (the "right" to) Internet access for some period of time (by court order). It's happened before (and been covered here).
But... how much you want to bet that MediaDefender gets off with less than a slap on the wrist?
With luck, at the very least, MediaDefender will lose the civil suit brought against them and pay that way.
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Foot, meet mouth (Score:5, Insightful)
But that they have a big fat pipe dedicated to conducting DOS attacks? Jesus F. Christ, that's like saying that I have a car dedicated to running down pedestrians I don't like. If that's not a confession of premeditation, I don't know what is.
To put it in perspective, the western criminal system (as far as I understand it, and IANAL) tries, or theoretically should try, to establish the degree of intent (or "mens rea" = "guilty mind") in an act. So for example, if a shingle off my roof fell on the a passerby's head, although what happened is the same and the guy is just as dead, you can have very different punishments based on the nuance of being classified anywhere between "direct intention" (I actually intended to have shingles fall on him/someone) and "criminal negligence" (I had no flippin' clue that the roof is in that bad condition, though a reasonable person should have foreseen and inspected it regularly.) The worst you can do is not only go for "direct intention", but also basically say, "oh yeah, it wasn't a momentary act of rage, it was planned all along."
So these guys have basically been paying all along for a pipe _dedicated_ to breaking the law? They actually had a plan to break the law, and month after month paid the bill on the resources set aside for only that purpose? Geesh. I hope that a few executives land in state jail there.
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Not only shamed, but pied as well (Score:5, Insightful)
Sheesh.
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Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Interesting)
Actually they can't get away with the "fake torrent" stuff either - the torrents they put up were for copyright material, which they then tracked to see who was downloading the stuff. In other words, they enabled copyright infringement, then went after the downloaders with "we know you've been infringing - contact the settlement center."
Since they were working with the blessing of the **AA, what that means is that anyone downloading from one of those torrents isn't guilty of copyright infringement, since the download was made available with the knowledge and consent of the **AA.
Discovery is going to be really nasty in this case.
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Re:Mediadefender is the Punisher (Score:5, Insightful)
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Now, really? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Now, really? (Score:5, Informative)
"In May 2008, MediaDefender was publicly accused of allegedly being the source of a distributed-denial- of-service attack on Revision3. Jim Louderback, Revision3 CEO charged that these attacks violated the Economic Espionage Act and the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act. The Federal Bureau of Investigations is currently investigating the incident."
Although that may have been written as of 5 minutes ago... plus the FBI isnt exactly notorious for accomplishing things in any sort of justified, or timely manour, and may very well side with MediaDefender.
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Re:Now, really? (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Now, really? (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:You forget, theyre the "darlings" of congress. (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm sorry what? When has the **AA ever violated human rights? Sure they're scumbags, but try to keep a little perspective. They're not exactly selling people into slavery.
The solution to the problem of them being "in" with congress is to give congress, and the government in general, less power. Power is abused. Always. This seems to be a pretty good example of that.
Reference?
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Re:You forget, they're the "darlings" of congress. (Score:5, Funny)
There's even a poster [russiablog.org].
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Re:You forget, theyre the "darlings" of congress. (Score:5, Informative)
From the Universal Declaration of Human Rights:
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Re:You forget, theyre the "darlings" of congress. (Score:5, Informative)
Yeah, but that's the risk people knowingly take when they decide to infringe the **AA's copyrights. They had to consciously think "I know I can get a huge fine for this, but I'm going to do it anyway." Is it really too much to expect people to take responsibility for their actions?
Right now, the legal choices are:
There is no "Disregard the law and do whatever you want" option. If they're willfully breaking the law, it shouldn't be a very big surprise when they get punished for it. And right now the penalty for copyright infringement is a big fine.
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Re:You forget, theyre the "darlings" of congress. (Score:5, Informative)
Except there have been cases where the person did not violate their copyrights. They don't prove someone did it before threatening or suing them, and those people who are innocent still have to fight to prove they're innocent. Then the RIAA holds up paying damages in court for years -- like the case where they tried to claim they shouldn't be liable for attorney's fees. I can't recall the specifics but they were found to be wrong and the defendant then sued them for costs and they called her claimed attorney's fees "outrageous" then refused to publish their own lawyer fees*. It was on Slashdot a few months ago.
* "Objection, your honor!"
"On what grounds?"
"...It's extremely damaging to my case!"
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Non-mainstream event (Score:5, Insightful)
Fry. (Score:5, Insightful)
So tell me why MediaDefender gets away with inserting fake data labeled as copyright-violating material into someone else's server and then going all vigilante on them. If you own the copyright you might be able to get away with it as its no longer in violation of copyrights since its yours, but since MediaDefender doesn't own them directly..
That on top of the damages they have caused this company, in either time, money, or business damages.
Re:Fry. (Score:5, Insightful)
Assuming for a brief moment that copyright infringement is theft, just for the purpose of this analogy...
If I broke into your house and put someone else's stuff in your room, then phoned the police that you have stolen property in your room... how nice would that be?
I only have one question: how can we retaliate?
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Re:Fry. (Score:5, Interesting)
If I broke into your house and put someone else's stuff in your room, then phoned the police that you have stolen property in your room... how nice would that be?
If I broke into your house and put someone else's stuff in your room, then waited until you came home and then smashed all your car windows with baseball bat while sceaming "theif" and your stood by in confused amazement, and then after I got done with that called the cops on you about the stolen property in your room... how nice would that be?
No very nice, and if anyone else tried it, even if you had really stolen the property and put it in your room my actions would still be a crime of their own. MediaDefender are criminals and the people operating those servers can't be so ignorant of the actions not be accountable for them. We might not be able to get the kingpins but at the very least the doers should be arrested and charged. I know slashdot does not like to go after the little guy but MediaDefenders developers, network, and server admins deserve jail time! If my boss asks me to do something illegal I am still obligated to refuse otherwise the law will hold me responsible. Its imporatant that even these little guys get PUNISHED. The only way you stop getting organizations like MediaDefender from being above the law is to make sure nobody will work for them, because no salary they can offer will be worth doing time for!
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Re:Fry. (Score:5, Insightful)
Retaliate is not the word I would choose, but things you can do...
1) Be nice and professional, but write your congressmen, senators and governors and tell them how you feel about the issue.
2) Write the transit providers that provide peering agreements with MediaDefenders service provider. Their service provider and the transit providers that peer with their service provider are supporting their actions indirectly. If their service provider refuses to continue service with Media Defender then they will be forced to move. If other transit providers refuse to peer with their / or a service provider that supports their actions, their service provider will be forced to change their business position or go out of business.
3) MediaDefender is primarily funded by copyright holders, the irony being that the copyrighted works have absolutely no value if there is no demand. If XYZ studio, producer or artist employs the services of MediaDefender, do not purchase their products. Simple.
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Re:Fry. (Score:5, Funny)
Kaffee: It was oregano, Dave. It was 10 dollars worth of oregano.
Lieutenant Dave Spradling: Yeah, but your client thought it was marijuana.
Kaffee: My client's a moron that's not against the law.
Lieutenant Dave Spradling: Kaffee, I have people to answer to just like you do. I'm going to charge him.
Kaffee: With what? Possession of a condiment?
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Re:Fry. (Score:5, Interesting)
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I think... (Score:5, Funny)
What I can't understand... (Score:5, Insightful)
Isn't DoSing also a Homeland Security issue? Shouldn't their ISP have cut them off when they started doing illegal things like automatically targeting innocent companies with illegal DoS Attacks?
If someone did to MediaDefender what they do to EVERYONE ELSE, they'd be screaming bloody murder!
Finally, what if they DID actually DoS a company that caused someone to be hurt or die. Would they be liable for pre-mediated murder?
Revision 3 is lucky! (Score:5, Funny)
Explain? (Score:5, Insightful)
Try to explain? The bottom line is MediaDefender attacked another commercial entity.
If someone throws a stink bomb through a brick & mortar storefront window, forcing the store to close, do you think the police would allow the offender to get off with saying, "oops"?
Inexcusable (Score:5, Funny)
Full mp3s on their website (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Full mp3s on their website (Score:5, Interesting)
heres a listing of files
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/HBO_Watcher.avi [mediadefender.com]
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/HumanWeapon_Karate_SneakPeak.mov [mediadefender.com]
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/JAY-Z_LIMEWIRE.wmv [mediadefender.com]
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/Kanye_West-Graduation-Stronger.zip [mediadefender.com]
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/MP3_Music_Sponsorship_Presentation.ppt [mediadefender.com]
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/MediaDefenderP2PDemo.exe [mediadefender.com]
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/MediaDefender_one-sheet.pdf [mediadefender.com]
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/MediaDefender_presentation-8_15_07.ppt [mediadefender.com]
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/Sample_p2p_MarketingReport.ppt [mediadefender.com]
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/Sprint%20-%20Parking%20-%20H264.mov [mediadefender.com]
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/Timbaland-The_Way_I_Are.zip [mediadefender.com]
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/jayz_coca_cola.wmv [mediadefender.com]
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/lebron_yall.wmv [mediadefender.com]
http://www.mediadefender.com/marketing/sampleReport.ppt [mediadefender.com]
heres a screenshot of the folder
http://b.imagehost.org/0325/Image2.jpg [imagehost.org]
and here is a mirror of the folder contents
http://ifile.it/_rcytws3/mediadefender [ifile.it]
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Re:Uh (Score:5, Informative)
BitTorrent is a legitimate method of distributing data, no matter what kind of data. It just happens to be a great way to send your entire mp3 collection to 12 friends in very little time and that's why people associate it with piracy and the like.
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Re:Uh (Score:5, Interesting)
Because of a BT tracker. Yeah, right.
In Revision3's case, there might have been illegal file sharing occuring - thats only a civil case if memory serves - and certainly MediaDefender's attack was criminal. In the hospital's case, MediaDefender would risk becoming downright murderers.
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Re:Mail Servers (Score:5, Informative)
sales@mediadefender.com
info@mediadefender.com
jobs@mediadefender.com
president: try herrera@mediadefender.com, oh@mediadefender.com,
ceo: try randy@mediadefender.com (personal), saaf@mediadefender.com or rsaaf@mediadefender.com
controller: try: rr@mediadefender.com, rousselet@mediadefender.com
parent company: artistdirect (stock ticker: ARTD)
Investor relations: ir@artistdirect.com
Chairman: diamond@artistdirect.com
CEO: try villard@artistdirect.com, dv@artistdirect.com
Auditors: Gumbiner, Savett, Finkel, Fingleson & Rose, Inc
rgreene@gscpa.com (Ronald Greene) http://marketcenter.findlaw.com/scripts/display_profile.pl?id=173844 [findlaw.com]
Have fun.
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