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Microsoft Ties $235m IT Aid To Use of Windows

Posted by Zonk on Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:01 PM
from the developing-countries-just-the-way-you-want-them dept.
E5Rebel writes "Microsoft will spend $235m in schools worldwide over the next five years, part of a plan to triple the number of students and teachers trained in its software programs to up to 270 million by 2013. 'Microsoft's investment shows how important it views developing markets to its future business. Last year, Microsoft introduced the Student Innovation Suite, which includes the XP Starter Edition plus educational applications, for $3 for qualifying countries. Microsoft faces heated competition from companies supporting the open-source OS Linux and associated software in developing countries. "I think as a company we welcome choice," [Orlando Ayala] said. "Frankly, we welcome the competition." The company's educational funding comes with a hitch: "Of course, that includes the fact they [the schools] use Windows," Ayala said.' If you don't use Windows you don't get the cash." Microsoft has long been interested in the education of children.
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[+] Microsoft Would Settle For The Children 780 comments
The news from MSNBC is that Microsoft wants to, er, settle for the children. Take that whichever way you want. They propose to settle civil anti-trust cases (not the DoJ suit) with a $1.1 billion (retail value) spanking (they have $36 billion in the bank), consisting of free computer goodies to our nation's poorest schools (the first hit's free, kids). I'm sure Microsoft will upgrade those old computers to keep them current, in perpetuity, for free, out of the kindness of their hearts, but in an apparent oversight that was left out of the news report. Of that $1.1 billion, $0.9 billion will be software presumably valued at whatever Microsoft wants to charge (see "monopoly"). For hardware and (laughable) training/support costs, Microsoft will be docked three weeks' worth of interest on their cashpile; they will seek matching funds for the remainder, I am not making this up. Some lawyers opposed this but "concluded that Microsoft's monopoly already is so pervasive that students would have to learn to use these products anyway in the workplace." Update: 11/20 21:22 GMT by M : Heh. Red Hat offers an alternative to Microsoft's settlement proposal - you provide hardware, we'll provide software.
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  • by mr_resident (222932) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:06PM (#22139406)

    it's where they get all their best ideas!

    (calm down modders - it's just a joke)
    • Actually... (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Mongoose Disciple (722373) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:11PM (#22139490)
      Isn't this pretty similar to what Apple was doing with schools back in the 80's?
      • If true then MSFT is even copying the one application at a time by using windows starter edition.

        i say if as I don't know apple's eduction history.
      • Re:Actually... (Score:5, Informative)

        by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday January 22 2008, @01:28PM (#22140684)
        It's similar but different. Apple sold hardwares at a steep discount to schools, but they don't offer money to school to be used only to buy Apple hardwares. Sometimes they donated hardwares too. The distinction is important since the school aren't under any obligation to force Apple's platform on students. OTOH, schools are obligated to force MS solutions on students. Of course, you may argue that the schools are not under obligation to receive the cash, but do you know what school refuses cash? Once a monetary donation is given, schools are free to appropriately use the fund in any way they see fit as long as it doesn't violate the general guideline of the donation. Dictating a specific solution as a condition of a donation is inappropriate. It violates the principle of academic freedom.

        IMHO, these platform wars has no place at schools. Students who work for a computer degree should understand computer basics and a little bit of each major platform. Then they can specialize in a platform they are interested in. It's still called computer science and computer engineering, isn't it? Not Windows science and Windows engineering. If students aren't interested in the basics and the other platforms, they can just go to a vocational school specializing in Windows softwares. There is no need to waste time with other stuff.
        • One thing that isn't clear in the article and seems important is whether schools need to agree to exclusively use Windows to receive the cash.

          If it's the case that a school can take this money to provide some Windows machines and still provide other OS machines normally at their expense, I can't see how this would be anything but good for the students. If it's an exclusive deal, I'd agree with you that that really isn't good for the students, unless the school is so poor that this is the only way they're g
        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          ...unless they're taking huge tax deductions on what is essentially money spent to buy marketshare.
        • Re:Actually... (Score:5, Informative)

          by plopez (54068) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @02:50PM (#22142162)
          AFAIK, Apple gave discounts to educational institutions, but never mandated that they be exclusively an Apple network.
    • I hate it when I glance at something and read it slightly wrong. Ever happen to you?

      If you don't use Windows you don't get the crash.
    • Last year, Microsoft introduced the Student Indoctrination Suite, which includes the XP Stuckwithit Edition plus educational applications, for $3 for groveling countries. Microsoft has avoided competition from companies supporting the open-source OS Linux and associated software except in countries which can be bought off. "I think as a company we welcome choice," [Orlando Ayala] said. "Frankly, we welcome the competition, we just don't like other people trying to take our business." The company's education
  • Subsidy not aid (Score:5, Insightful)

    by MosesJones (55544) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:07PM (#22139428) Homepage
    This isn't aid, its a subsidy to grow the Windows market. Aid would be focused on the end-goal of the people, not on the end-goal of the company.

    This is a blatant case of a monopoly subsidising to establish itself in emerging markets.

    The NYT has a page that is still up [nytimes.com]
    • Re:Subsidy not aid (Score:5, Insightful)

      by jorghis (1000092) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:23PM (#22139700)
      Free training is not monopoly subsidising. Its just a different business model, they charge for the software and give free training. Other companies give away the software and make their money on support and training. There is nothing wrong with giving away free stuff (like training) in order to grow your market share.

      I would like to see more competition in the consumer OS market as well and MS may have crossed the line in the past, but screaming "monopoly abuse!" every time MS makes any kind of business deal is just silly.
      • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

        The problem here is that I don't pay taxes to fund public schools so Microsoft can go advertise their products. Enhancing vendor lock through targeting public institutions is not cool with me. OTOH, maybe open-source advocates should just offer free training and resources of their own.

        Withholding judgment...

        • Re:Subsidy not aid (Score:4, Interesting)

          by hansonc (127888) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @01:56PM (#22141180) Homepage
          If your school district were properly funded through your tax dollars they wouldn't need to take Microsoft's money to fill out their budget needs. Until people figure out that they should be voting for every single school bonding issue, schools need to come up with funds somewhere. They might as well take Microsoft's money and provide education in the software the students will need to know when they get out of school.
              • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

                Wouldn't want kids to have any training on the software they're going to be using in the real world now would we?

                When I was at school we were trained on Acorns (as was pretty much everyone in the UK at the time). Certainly not what is used in industry. I'm not convinced this caused harm - if anything I think it helped develop the skills needed to use *any* system rather than just learning MS software by rote.

                In any case, whether you teach kids MS Office or OpenOffice when they are at school, by the time
      • Re:Subsidy not aid (Score:4, Insightful)

        by cHiphead (17854) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @01:45PM (#22140996)
        Thats the problem, the training isnt free, its SUBSIDIZED. You HAVE to use MS products in exchange for their 'free' training. There is an ethical line you can cross by using a monopoly position coupled with free training to grow market share. Not mention possible tax fraud if MS is writing off all of this money spent and in turn getting a kickback in the form of new sales and other market growth factors.

        Cheers.
      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        Free training is not monopoly subsidising. Its just a different business model, they charge for the software and give free training. Other companies give away the software and make their money on support and training. There is nothing wrong with giving away free stuff (like training) in order to grow your market share.

        This isn't "free training" - Microsoft are trying to shape the existing educational system to push their agenda. IMHO *no* company should be able to influence the direction of general educati
    • Wow... I didn't see this coming. I figured it was impossible for Microsoft to undercut free software... guess I was wrong! I'm teaching my kids Ubuntu, however, I can be bribed to switch :-) If Microsoft would like one less slashdotter bashing Windows, a promise of free lifetime software and maybe a few hundred bucks would do the trick.
    • Re:Subsidy not aid (Score:5, Insightful)

      by natenovs (1055338) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:34PM (#22139862)
      When I was in elementary school none of our class rooms had computers. My fifth grade teacher when to the Microsoft Technology training course and was able to get our class room 5 computers. This was my first exposure to computers. I don't care if you hate Microsoft, the fact that they put a keyboard in my hands got me interested in computing. I would not be where I am today if that did not happen. To this I am grateful to Microsoft, and more accurate probably, my fifth grade teacher.
  • I saw something similar to this this weekend as I was riding a bus to NYC. A billboard in Delaware or some other state said "FREE $50 When You Join!" referring to a casino membership. But in very fine print (hilariously fine for the size of the billboard) it said, "Money must be spent inside the casino within a half hour of joining." I remember thinking to myself, that sure is free.

    How free is something when you're told what to spend it on? How free is money when it goes into a fund that invests in the United States companies and stock markets and you can't control that fund?

    My answer would be 'not very' but, you know, when you see these 'donations' from the rich like Bill Gates, that seems to be the case every single time. I'm glad they're getting something, I'm upset about the strings attached. Better than nothing, yes. But sounding more and more like a fishy tax loophole or legacy purchase (he'll go down in history as a philanthropist no doubt) every day.
  • by houstonbofh (602064) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:08PM (#22139436)
    It looks like they are giving free software and support valued at the overinflated prices Microsoft gets for there product. Using this metric, Ubuntu is also donating $235 million to schools, students, businesses and people. (Support via Ubuntu Forums)
    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      It looks like they are giving free software and support

      What's very funny is Microsoft had a 10 question quiz in an ad here on slashdot. The quiz was to "test your knowledge of software licensing". For grins, I took the test. It will not let you go got the next question (training maze) until you got the current question correct. If they just scored it, I would have done poorly as I chose what a consumer friendly answer should be. Taking the quiz fully convinced me that with GNU style licenses out there,
      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        It doesn't cost Ubuntu anything (in practical terms) to do that. It does cost Microsoft to do that. Microsoft pays people to work for them. Time absolutely is money.

        It absolutely does cost Ubuntu/Canonical, and in very practical terms. The entity controlling the distribution *does* spend money to pay some staff to make it all go, from development to marketing to professionally producing install/live cds to hosting and administration of their central repositories, forums, etc. The "time is money" argumen

  • Here's the story, Yahoo! [yahoo.com]

  • by iONiUM (530420) * on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:09PM (#22139464) Journal
    Maybe they're giving out, oh I dunno, licenses for Windows and free copies that amount to that much money? What the fuck do you expect them to do, buy the equivalent value of Macs and give that instead?
  • by jorghis (1000092) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:11PM (#22139482)
    Why is it a surprise they would only fund free training for their own software? I mean isnt that kind of a duh thing? Are linux companies sinister too now because they dont pay for free windows training for people who dont buy linux?
    • Careful, dude, this is Slashdot. Special pleading for open source software is allowed and even encouraged.

      I mean, what non-zealot could even half take the premise of this article/editorial seriously?

    • Why is it a surprise they would only fund free training for their own software? I mean isn't that kind of a duh thing? Are Linux companies sinister too now because they don't pay for free windows training for people who don't buy Linux?

      It's no surprise. The disappointment is the requirements.

      From TFA:

      "Of course, that includes the fact they [the schools] use Windows," Ayala said.' If you don't use Windows you don't get the cash."

      It doesn't matter what the intentions are.

      That makes so much sense to me. It wouldn't be logical for Microsoft or any company to donate money for their competition (i.e. donate money for computers to run competing software). I would not suspect anything else from a for-profit company. I'm sure Microsoft's shareholders would agree. Nothing new in this news.

  • by LWATCDR (28044) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:15PM (#22139546) Homepage Journal
    Why wouldn't Microsoft offer support to Schools that teach Windows and not offer support to schools that do not?
    This isn't some foundation it is a company. Sorry but this isn't shocking or news. Do you think Novell or Redhat would donate money to schools that teach Windows?
    • The trouble is, Microsoft does "aid" projects like this, and then wants to be treated as though they've just committed some great act of charity.

      They can't have it both ways.
      • All acts of charity are acts of selfishness. Would you donate time / money to any cause if it caused you some kind of pain or made you feel bad?
    • I don't think a convicted monopolist should be allowed to do this at all, and should have some substantial fraction of its net worth seized as punishment.
  • Water is still wet.

    It gets dark at night.

  • by hawks5999 (588198) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:19PM (#22139618)
    Can I mod an article -1 Troll?
  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:21PM (#22139654)
    ...Microsoft to pay for future customers.

    Which means they would have to increase prices for their software, which makes more people decide to use the free open source alternatives instead.

    I just love it when a plan comes together. ;)

    muhahahahaha!!!
  • by saterdaies (842986) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:22PM (#22139686)
    In 10 grants contingent on recipients of said aid only use it to purchase special Educational Grant Editions of my Ubuntu clone at a cost of $600,000,000,000 a piece. That way, I'm donating a huge amount, but I don't actually have to donate a penny (unless I'm off by a decimal place there).

    On a more serious level, I could donate $1,000,000 to schools that could only be used to buy licenses of my slightly modified Ubuntu clone and never have to spend money - if they don't buy my licenses, they don't get the money; if they do buy my Ubuntu clone, I get the money back and maybe have to eat the cost of some CD-Rs.

    "Donating" money that can only be used to purchase an intangible good (and software, other than the physical media, is intangible) from yourself is like donating nothing - especially when you're donating to people who wouldn't buy your product if it weren't being given to them.
    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      You missed one point. You also write it off as a tax deductible. If you try to write off $600,000,000,000 as a tax deductible expect black helicopters and men with assault rifles as a responce to your tax return. If a company with a turnover bigger than some nation's GDP does this, it gets an applause in the press for its enormous charitable contribution. Which is a pity - it should get the same treatment (scaled for size - cannons instead of assault rifles).
  • What's going to really cook the noodle is how they came up with 'spending' 235Mil. Why not 250? How about 500? Did they calculate how many versions of Windows each potential customer will purchase in their life time and take inflation into account. Then figured that a 1 to 4 or 5 return value over 25 years isn't a bad investment after all.

    I don't care for M$ either (while typing this on a M$ platform, necessary evil..blah,blah,blah), but you have to give them credit for trying to continue growing their cust
  • Wrong! (Score:4, Interesting)

    by goldspider (445116) <`moc.liamg' `ta' `97ekardra'> on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:31PM (#22139818) Homepage
    Microsoft faces heated competition from companies supporting the open-source OS Linux and associated software in developing countries.

    Microsoft isn't confronting competition in these targeted regions, they're confronting rampant piracy of their OS. They figure it's better to get $3.00 per copy than nothing.
  • by mormop (415983) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @12:50PM (#22140088)
    I seem to remember that along with using an existing monopoly to leverage one of the illegal sides of monopoly is the concept of predatory pricing, i.e. deliberately pricing a product well below it's market value in order to strike down a competitor.

    With the cost of Windows as it is, "giving" software to schools along with a condition that they must be using Windows is about as predatory as you can get. What's the EU's phone number again?
  • by mlwmohawk (801821) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @01:06PM (#22140354)
    This is an example of how evil Microsoft is. They'll donate some "thing" only as long as it contributes to their business. Why this is wrong is pretty subtle. They have no intention of saving anyone any money. Typically with contributions, the outcome is a net gain for the organization receiving the contribution. Not with this deal, this will be a net loss for the schools receiving the "grants." Only the costs will be differed.

    The "training" microsoft is talking about is their typical "training" where general concepts and understanding is not part of the instructional course except where necessary to use their product. If you have ever taken any Microsoft training courses you'll know what I'm talking about. A networking class is not about networking, but about "their" networking tools.

    I have taken a couple Microsoft courses for various reasons, and have always come away saying (1) that was a huge waste of time. (2) It was like a big commercial for Microsoft products. (3) It was useless in any practical sense.

    Now, all these nicely trained people aren't going to be looking at the cost-saving alternatives like OpenOffice and/or Linux, nope, they'll be revved up to buy MS Office and Windows (because that's what they were trained on!)

    My Advice, when Microsoft offers you anything for free, turn it down, because it will always end up costing you.
          • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

            So was it Evil when Jobs did it?

            Of course it was, but when a small marginal player does something "evil," it's impact is mitigated by its ability to capitalize on it. When a convicted monopolist does something evil, everyone suffers.
  • by Comboman (895500) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @01:23PM (#22140592)
    While slightly off-topic, the end of the referenced article is far more interesting:

    While Microsoft is nudging consumers and businesses in developed markets to use its latest Windows Vista operating system, XP will remain the OS the company supports for low-cost laptops such as the Asus Eee and Intel's Classmate PC, Ayala said.

    The reason is XP has a smaller footprint than Vista, Ayala said, referring to factors such as how much memory the OS uses and the size of the OS on a PC's hard drive.

    Microsoft is still working through some of the "technical limitations" that remain in putting XP on the XO, the green PC from the One Laptop Per Child project, Ayala said.

    Considering MS is already talking about Vista's replacement next year with Windows 7, is anyone else shocked that they are continuing to put development resources into XP?

  • by walterbyrd (182728) on Tuesday January 22 2008, @01:24PM (#22140624)
    I am reminded of that Simpson's episode with the Oscar Myer periodic chart with "bolognium" and "delicium."

    I think schools should turn this msft "gift" down. There is nothing that msft is offering, that does not have a free alternative.

    I am sure a lot of people will label me a linux zealot. But the truth is, I completely understand that linux is not for everybody. But schools are a different matter. Schools should teach vendor-neutral concepts. Students should not be taught that vendor specific jargon and standards are somehow universal. For example, what msft calls a "domain" is different than what is commonly understood. I already notice a lot of students thinking that anything non-msft is non-standard.

    Unlike commercial institutions, students do not have the same concerns about the acceptance of vendor specific document formats. For example, some accountants will only accept Intuit formated income statements - so some small businesses have to use Intuit, but students should be able to learn the concepts of accounting, and accounting concepts, without being tied to a specific vendor.

    Again, I want to emphasize: students should be taught *concepts* then those concepts can be applied to software from any vendor. Schools should not be in the business of promoting a particular vendor - especially if that vendor does not offer anything that is that freely available anyway.

    Sometimes it is very difficult to avoid vendor-lock, but for students, it's easy. So why be vendor locked if you don't have to be?
    • Yes, however, the "m" after the dollar figure isn't an SI measurement.

      You're being pedantic, but you also don't know what the fuck you're talking about. Which is nothing new for this website.